I'd agree with that even if Onkyo had fair to good customer support. I alas, cannot avail myself of Onkyo's support because I bought my 885 from someone who managed to take delivery of two new units when there were few to be had, and there is absolutely no extension of warranty or support to non-original purchasers.

Unlike Outlaw, who I have noted goes the extra mile to support even owners of second hand units where reasonably possible.

He was down in your neck of the woods, Bob, if I recall your location correctly from a conversation a long time ago on HTT.