I received my 976 Friday morning, spent the evening looking over the manual and making a connection diagram. To put this in context, I am upgrading from a 990 so I was looking forward to a far simpler connection scheme. In the end I removed, literally handfuls of cables. Balance of the system consists of Gallo Reference 3.1s main and center, Vandersteen sub and surrounds LG OLED55C7 TV, Oppo 83 Bluray and a bottom of the line LG 4k Bluray.

Unit was packed in two boxes, cradled in that thick spongy foam. Manual, remote, etc was sitting on top so easily accessible. Connections were uneventful, only HDMI cables and one optical for a Sony CD Jukebox. The unit came with a Bluetooth receiver that plugs into the rear of the unit. The only item of note at this stage of setup was that my Vandersteen sub has a ground wire for eliminating ground loops. I had it attached to a chassis screw on the rear of the 990. I couldn't loosen any of the screws on the back of the 976 but could loosen one of the side screws securing the cover. Works for me.

Unit is attractive in a simple, straightforward way. My only complaint is that the blue led surrounding the power button is god awful bright. I hate extraneous lights to begin with, my room glows at night with all the little leds when everything is turned off. The remote is also quite nice, feels like aluminum face. The battery door remains attached when open so it won't fall un the floor under the couch, also a nice touch.
The vol +- buttons are the same size and shape as the other buttons which is a bit annoying. I use a Harmony remote for most normal functions so not a problem for me. This brings me to the first shortcomings I found. First, the 976 is not in the Harmony database, and I am told by Peter (more on that later) in won't be added by the Harmony folk. Since my remote never seems to work in code learning mode I was forced to tell it I had a model 975. At least the important buttons work (power, volume) and most inputs will switch but you have to map the 975 names to the 976 names. Only annoyance is that the 975 has fewer input so for me, one is not accessible for now from the Harmony. While on inputs, the names can't be edited and Pete tells me that will not change for this product but the will be other products.

Now for sound and picture. A warning that I have only watched some TV (Dish network) and one 4K disc thus far. Picture is great, I didn't notice any difference between the 976 doing the switching and my previous HDMI directly to the TV connections. Switching inputs is slow with some screen blinking before it settles down. Partly that is the LG, it puts up pretty pictures and some silly messages when it doesn't detect a signal. Sound for me was night and day over the 990. I'm retired, getting on a bit in years, and some hearing issues. I was loosing a lot of dialog if the volume wasn't sufficient before but I didn't loose one word yesterday with the 976 doing the work. I haven't listened to any music yet, perhaps this afternoon.

Forgot to mention, setup was the auto setup with the included mic. That's all for now, hope this is useful. I almost forgot to mention that after I got it initially setup I headed out for some grocery shopping. As I arrived at the store I got a phone call from Peter Tribeman at Outlaw. He said I was one of the first to receive a 976 and he was anxious for first impressions. We must have talked for 20-30 minutes about the 976, pluses, minuses, design tradeoffs etc. I was very impressed with them calling and spending so much time with me. It shows their dedication to producing a quality product and their interest in taking good care of us all. By the way, for those who ordered already, Peter said they brought an initial, large batch over by airplane so the could get them out to people to prove it is a real product. The balance are coming by ship.

Thank you for your comments. Did Peter explain why Harmony won't add this to their database? Which Harmony are you using? I have the 650 and it will learn codes from other remotes, although it would take a bit of time to transfer them from the 976 to the Harmony. This is a bit disconcerting.

I used the 950 briefly and it was a challenge, at times, with the remote and input identification. Using the Harmony, the names could be changed to accommodate my setup.

Looking forward to your further comments on sound quality for different sources. That is the important thing.

Thanks for posting your impressions of the 976. I hope to have mine soon. I hope they, Harmony and Outlaw, get over whatever reason the 976 won't be in the Harmony database. What a PITA it will be to have to "learn" the 976 codes into my new 950 remote that are not the same as the 975! I'm not too concerned about the 976 input names as I will be able to name the Harmony's Activities. It will be interesting to see how my new LG TV and the 976 work together when switching between sources. I plan on using an Apple TV, cable box and my OPPO.

Very good news on the 976's sound. I'm also upgrading from a 990 and besides the convenience of HDMI throughout, the improvement in DACs/sound was what I was looking forward to the most. Did you check the auto setup to see if it got all the parameters correct? I imagine I will do mine manually. Lastly, are you planning to use the 976's PEQ capabilities?

I have a Harmony One. I've had no luck getting it to learn codes no matter the angles of distance I hold the two remotes. No good explanation for why they won't add it, they are waiting for some owner to create the right codes or some such thing and then they will take copy and release. I think that's what he said.

I have a similar setup. I just talked to Peter again and he said the codes will be coming in the next few weeks. He'll be posting about it shortly. The sound is outstanding in comparison to the 990. I'll post more later today or tomorrow but it is night and day. As an example, I put on a Sara Bareilles disc that was recored live, playing it on the Direct setting and I needed to walk up to the speaker to be sure it wasn't a surround mode. There was a real sense of the hall it was recorded in, as though it was in surround but it was only the stereo fronts.

I haven't looked at what the auto setup did, will check later. As far as PEQ, I'm not familiar with the process but will probably look into it. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

bbaggin5,


Thank you so much for your feedback. The comments are very helpful to us.

We are all really excited that we are finally delivering the 976. I wanted to call the first three recipients of the processor to learn about their reactions first hand and answer any questions they might have. Today I will try to randomly contact a few more customers elsewhere in the country to ask for their early impressions of the 976.

I'd like to address a couple of your comments:

Regarding the brightness of the power button, the arguments always range from "I can't tell it's on in a bright room!" to "it's a nightlight in a dark room!" We will look at that again.

As for the Harmony codes, because this product is so new we have not yet had a chance to upload the new codes. In the near future that information will be ready to download.

Good News! the promised "fast boat" has arrived and the remaining units of our first production have just been delivered to our warehouse facilities. Starting tomorrow we will begin shipping out large quantities of 976's so that everyone who has placed an order will get their units for the holidays, or even much sooner.


Finally, we want to thank all of those who kept the faith that we would deliver a special processor in the under $900 price range. We believe it is a worthy successor to our Model 975.

Best regards,

Peter

Thanks for your additional input regarding the sound. I know the umik-1 is a bit expensive but I got one a few weeks ago and it has been worth it so far. With REW and the umik-1 I can now see what is going on in my room. If I can get REW to work with the 976, I doubt I will miss losing Audyssey in my current Marantz AVR.

I have a UMIK-1 coming and I'm looking forward to seeing how my family room behaves. I have already updated to REW V5.19 Beta 7 that includes the 976. I've never had any type of room correction so it will be interesting to toggle between applying PEQ and not. Did REW show any spikes or nulls in your room?

I have about a 20dB increase between 25Hz and 60Hz.

20dB is quite a bump. I think I have a similar increase in low frequencies in my family room and I always thought it was my modest subwoofer that was not up to the task. I suspect after applying the 976's PEQ settings your bass/LFE will be much less boomy and I'm hoping to achieve similar positive results.

That first post had me concerned about the Harmony issue - thanks for the clarification, Peter. I look forward to getting the 976 code into my Harmony One, AND Look forward to my 976 Christmas.

That's actually a nice problem to have! 20 dB is indeed to much bass, but for movie and pop/rock music, having 6-8 more dB in the bass region is often found to be pleasing. If your room is providing the lift by itself, that's like free sub power!

How did you arrive at that?

The increase is actually between 25Hz and 60Hz. I measured my PSA's sub response with REW and that is what the graph showed. That was with Audyssey turned off. The increase was not as much with Audyssey on.

Yes I am hoping that the PEQ of the 976 can help tame it a little. I won't be able to do anything about it for my music though, because I listen only through the 7.1 analog inputs. That is ok with me because the excellent dacs of my Oppo 205 sound so nice.

I have not thought about it that way but you make a good point. I don't really notice it with movies but I do with music. Certain songs on a couple of my MC Sacds have that added emphasis in the upper bass notes and it can sound a little odd at times. The rest of my sacds and dvd audio discs sound fantastic.

Be VERY cautious boosting your sub below ~25hz. Applying a wideband, modest cut in the middle of that bump is much safer

Good to reinforce that you shouldn't boost the output of a low frequency range because the amplifier can't overcome the suck out caused by the room. Or for that matter below the sub's frequency range. From my research it may be possible to make a modest reduction in a low frequency dip but it isn't likely to remove the majority of the dip.

Do the sub crawl, re-position sub and remeasure.

I'll get some of my own initial impressions over the weekend as my 976 is scheduled to arrive tomorrow. I'll only be able to do the normal setup without PEQ adjustments as my UMIK-1 mic won't arrive until later this month. However, my question is regarding remote codes:

I just checked the Harmony site and the 976 codes have not been added yet. If I tell the Harmony software I have a 975 will it work with the 976? Are the codes different or is it that some of the 976 codes are missing?

Some of the codes are similar but some are missing because there are new features in the 976. It is now in Harmony's hands.

Thanks, Peter. Not only the info on the 975/976 codes but also, I assume, that Harmony now has 976 codes and needs to make them available.

Yes, Harmony now has the 976 codes. In the case of the 975, they took their time to make those available.
However if they heard from some existing Harmony customers who just purchased the 976....... You get the idea.

Yup! I sent them a message last night in hopes of motivating them to promptly add the 976 to their database.

It's good to hear that Harmony will include the 976.

A question I have with owners of the 976 has to do with the amount of volume it takes to get a SPL of at least 75db from (all)DD and DTS soundtracks. According the the specs, it states that the volume range is -90 to 0db. To achieve at least 75db SPL, what is the volume number displayed on screen? Can it go to 85db SPL easily?

That is a very complicated question that depends on a number of factors including: gain of the amp, gain of the source device, efficiency of the speakers, and finally the dimensions and acoustics of the room. If you want a detailed explanation please call Ben at 866-688-5292.

Get the SPL meter app on your smart phone and crank it up until a white noise signal (radio station static will work) is at 75 db and note the indicated db on the dial. That should tell you some things about the system and its capabilities.

Just an update on my efforts to encourage Harmony to add the 976 to their product database. I exchanged a few messages with "KayHarmony", the last two are below, that may be of interest...


KayHarmony,

Thank you for your reply. I understand I can teach my Harmony 950 the commands of my new Outlaw 976 but as you noted it can be tedious and the steps may have to be repeated more than once. I'd like to avoid that process altogether.

The CEO of Outlaw Audio, Peter Tribeman, has advised Outlaw customers that they have forwarded the codes for their new Model 976 preamp/processor to Harmony. My request is that Harmony add the 976 to the database as soon as possible. Outlaw is shipping hundreds of this new pre/pro right now and many 976 customers are also Harmony customers. I, and I'm sure many other Harmony/Outlaw 976 customers, would sincerely appreciate it if the 976's codes and model were added to the Harmony product database as soon as possible.

Thank you.

AvFan
-----------------------------------------
From: KayHarmony (Logitech)

Dear AvFan,

Thank you for providing us detailed information. Once we get the codes for your device Outlaw 976, our data team will add your device to our database. Until then, I’d request your patience.

Thank you for understanding.
-----------------------------------------

If I had some more specifics on when and who the codes were sent to Logitech/Harmony I would reply to "KayHarmony" with that information so the Harmony data team can get cracking!

FYI, I tried to use the 975 codes and the inputs are different and it is a chore to modify them so getting the 976 in the Harmony database is a priority for me.

Hah! I should have looked at the Harmony database before I wrote the previous message. The 976 is now in the Harmony database. Yay!

I can't seem to find it in their database. i looked in the MyHarmony app on my Mac and on the web. Where did you find it?

in the box where you enter model number or product name, type "model 976" not just "976"

Is anybody else having trouble with the Harmony not using the right power on command for the 976?

My Impressions after two movies, one music dvd, one cd and bluetooth through my iphone :

Setup was fairly painless, though i have yet to connect 3.5 mono IR cables to the 976 and my Oppo BD-103.
Have not done any EQ yet and i may not. I may play with it one day, but my dedicated theater room is soundproofed and acoustically treated with GIK products and i cannot imagine it sounding better than it does.

I am coming from a 950 processor that has served me well for a long time - almost 12 years now! I ran the speaker RCA signals through an ICBM bass manager to the amps, setting all crossover activity in the 950 and oppo to large, meaning no crossover processing. This worked very well. All speakers are custom made using very high quality Dynaudio drivers from Denmark.

Now, im using the 976 crossover, the ICBM is gone, and with analog 7.1 outputs from the Oppo, im using the crossover in that. Simpler and less cables, but i love that ICBM !

HDMI Video signal to my Epson projector is now switched by the 976, where before i had it direct. There is no degradation that i can detect, but im more about audio, even though Im 57 now and my hearing is not great !

First movie i watched is well known to me - The Bourne Legacy.
Opening scene with Jeremy Renners character coming out of the freezing Alaskan river, when he is standing around the campfire I can hear the subtle sounds of the fire crackling and popping - never heard that before!
Next scene, the reporter is shot. Later Renner fires his rifle three times in the air, with accompanying echoes around the mountainside. The immediate sensory impact of these high powered rifle shots made me jump every time. Ive never heard those shots have such intense in-your-face sound. Every rifle shot after that impressed me. The motorcycle chase scene at the end was screaming around my room !
Very impressive, but this is DTS Master Audio 7.1 in and out, which my 950 couldnt do.

Next i watched/listened to Phil Collins First Farewell tour, recorded Live at Bercy, Paris. A 2004 release with DTS 5.1 being the highest level of audio available.
This concert disc set is also well known to me, and to be honest, i didnt detect much improvement listening to the DTS track over what my 950 could do. BUT, when i selected DIRECT 7.1 using the analog outputs from the OPPO, things really came to life far beyond the 950s ability. Vocal harmonies were the best ive heard anywhere period !
The Duet with Amy Keys "Separate Lives" was spine tingling, made especially so by Keys incredible voice and vocal range.
With the analog sound, you can just FEEL that nothing beyond the inital D/A is being added or subtracted or compressed. Extremely impressive lifelike sound.

I next listened to a CD through an excellent Marantz CD63SE player using the coaxial digital output. But it was too late for anything else to compare favorably to the Phil Collins disc. I should have done this first.
Same with Bluetooth. Sync issues were non problematic, but the sound was very so-so ! No better than i expected.

Ive been looking for a processor to upgrade from the 950 for some time and was looking to spend quite a bit more than the 976, but i wanted to stay with 7.2. Im glad i made this move.

5.1 System; I just put my 976 through the Auto Setup process. It registered 2 SB speakers not present and did not continue through the setup program. I then went to the speaker configuration menu and marked the SB speakers as "None." I then re-ran the program and it went through the entire program and gave an error message, "LS out of phase." Pretty cool, I would have never detected that...so I put the speaker in phase and ran the program again. The error was corrected, and different parameters were set for the out of phase speaker. Nicely done, Outlaw Audio! Sound is amazing...very clear, and the picture is outstanding...running THX Cinema on most sources (OTA Tivo; Apple TV; Fire TV; Blu-ray). This was not possible with my Denon 3808 CI. I played a concert Blu-ray, Rolling Stones 1978 Tour of Some Girls...no speaker level adjustment needed, and it sounded full and balanced.

Very nice review. I had the opportunity to use the Model 950 for a brief period, so your comparison is invaluable.
A question about the use of your OPPO BDP-103. Have you tried using HDMI 2 output for audio vs. the 7.1 analog outs?

Anything abnormal with your CD player playing thru digital connexion? Have you tested several CDs? Mine is having issues!

What issues, Deromax?

Nothing abnormal. The Marantz works fine. Ive used it with the Coax digital out for its whole life. What problems are you having ?

[/quote]
Very nice review. I had the opportunity to use the Model 950 for a brief period, so your comparison is invaluable.
A question about the use of your OPPO BDP-103. Have you tried using HDMI 2 output for audio vs. the 7.1 analog outs? [/quote]

Beach, You made me get the Oppo manual out to see what you were talking about. I see where it says superior audio and superior video can be obtained by splitting the A/V between the 2 hdmi's.
I have not tried that. How is the 976 going to deal with two hdmi inputs (1 audio and 1 video) though. How would i set that up?
Thanks for pointing that out.

On some CDs, maybe 30% of them, the 976 will "lose the signal" in the silence between tracks, and when the next track begins, there is a short delay before the sound un-mute and resume with a fade-in, resulting in a loss of half the first second of the track. The same behavior is hapening when playing files on iTunes in a computer, via Bluetooth. I find this highly annoying. In pop/rock, it's often the first drums hit that is outright obliterated!

Here are a few CD titles that are affected here :

The immaculate collection - Madonna
Past to present - Toto
Violator - Depeche mode
Nevermind - Nirvana
Under the pink - Tori Amos
On every street - Dire straits

In a private discussion with Ben from outlaw's CS, I'm told this is unavoidable in modern HDMI based products, so the discussion about this issue may be moot. If you don't experience the issue, it's because you have the luck to have a player that is outputing a continuous bitstream even while there is idle space between tracks on the disc. I'm told Oppo have models that are doing this. Maybe the Marantz is too.

I may have to use the analog inputs, which would of course bypass the great DACs and DSP in the 976. I listen to music much more often than watching movies, so this is a big deal for me.

Very nice review. I had the opportunity to use the Model 950 for a brief period, so your comparison is invaluable.
A question about the use of your OPPO BDP-103. Have you tried using HDMI 2 output for audio vs. the 7.1 analog outs? [/quote]

Beach, You made me get the Oppo manual out to see what you were talking about. I see where it says superior audio and superior video can be obtained by splitting the A/V between the 2 hdmi's.
I have not tried that. How is the 976 going to deal with two hdmi inputs (1 audio and 1 video) though. How would i set that up?
Thanks for pointing that out. [/quote]

Since I don't have a pre amp that has HDMI, I can't speak from experience. However, I've read many accounts where people have connected HDMI 1 to the display and HDMI 2 to the AVR or pre.
I was just curious to see if you were using either HDMI for audio vs. the analog outs from the OPPO.

After a busy few weeks, I got to set up my new 976 and Oppo 203.
I did the auto set up with the mic for now. It set my speaker levels and distance, there were no phase problems.
The distance was pretty accurate.

I played a couple of movies with both Dolby Atmos tracks and DTS-X tracks...Mad Max and Passengers both have the Dolby Atmos tracks. The 976 plays the core 7.1 channels of Dolby TrueHD
Coming from a 975, the sound is everything I would expect it to be, very impressive.
I also played Lone Survivor with a DTS-X track and that played the 7.1 DTS HDMA core. This sounds great as well.

As for the remote, I don't have a complaint with any of the functionality. I sit a bit towards the left of my room that's 26 x 13. The system is off to the right front corner of the room and I'm usually about 12-14 feet away.

The rear of the area is open to the next room where I can stand even further back than 26 feet- closer to 30 feet away with no problems controlling the 976. I do have a Harmony 750 that I'll be using, but I wanted to try the remote given all that I've read on the Saloon. Plus, I'd rather use the Outlaw remote to do any set up stuff.
I haven't delved into the EQ or REW yet. Need to find the time for that and figure out the best way to accomplish this.

The BlueTooth pairs quite easily and the sound is great enough for me with excellent range.

As for playing music through the new Oppo, I played a few cd's. Some were, commercially mastered, and some I made from my Yamaha CD recorder.

I have a 2 CD set of "Masters of Reggae" that I popped in. The 976 does show the boxes on the right side disappear and re-appear with the track change, but this is quite fast and I don't miss the beginning of any of the tracks, not like what I experienced with the 975. The 976 seems to re-acquire the next track immediately.

As for a sample CD I made, some of it is from live recordings that will continue from one track to the next with the applause helping to lead into the next song. There is no loss of signal with this transition.

I loaded a playlist on a USB stick and played it from the Oppo.
I do hear, on some of the tracks, a slight (quick) fade-in at the start. This depends on the track though, as on some of the songs, it's not evident.

So far, I must say the 976 is performing as I'd hoped it would. I hadn't listened to music much with the 975, so
after reading others experience in the saloon, I wanted to try to duplicate what they were describing.

The experience I have from the 975 to the 976 with playing music via HDMI is like night and day, as I would miss almost the first musical note or word of dialog, due to being about a second late with the 975.

Not so with the 976.

This is a great piece of equipment Outlaw has produced. It may be in my system for a long time, given I have no interest in an Atmos system.

Beachbum..you would put the OPPO primary video out directly to the TV and the OPPO second HDMI to the 976

[/quote]

Since I don't have a pre amp that has HDMI, I can't speak from experience. However, I've read many accounts where people have connected HDMI 1 to the display and HDMI 2 to the AVR or pre.
I was just curious to see if you were using either HDMI for audio vs. the analog outs from the OPPO. [/quote]

Oh - got ya !
No I have not run a separate HDMI for audio and compared to the analog outputs. With the 950, i used coaxial digital audio from the Oppo and ran hdmi video direct to the display from the Oppo.
I was looking forward to finally having a processor capable of switching video without degradation, so i didnt have to switch inputs on my projector. Therefore i only have the one HDMI carrying both A&V to the 976, along with the 7.1 analog.
I misunderstood initially what you were saying. I thought you meant to use two HDMIs from the Oppo to the 976, and i couldnt grasp just how that would work. My mistake !
Im going to leave it as is for now and do some reading about this splitting. Maybe i'll try it and see if it is indeed vastly superior sonically !
Do you recall where you saw this discussed ?

Since I don't have a pre amp that has HDMI, I can't speak from experience. However, I've read many accounts where people have connected HDMI 1 to the display and HDMI 2 to the AVR or pre.
I was just curious to see if you were using either HDMI for audio vs. the analog outs from the OPPO. [/quote]

Oh - got ya !
No I have not run a separate HDMI for audio and compared to the analog outputs. With the 950, i used coaxial digital audio from the Oppo and ran hdmi video direct to the display from the Oppo.
I was looking forward to finally having a processor capable of switching video without degradation, so i didnt have to switch inputs on my projector. Therefore i only have the one HDMI carrying both A&V to the 976, along with the 7.1 analog.
I misunderstood initially what you were saying. I thought you meant to use two HDMIs from the Oppo to the 976, and i couldnt grasp just how that would work. My mistake !
Im going to leave it as is for now and do some reading about this splitting. Maybe i'll try it and see if it is indeed vastly superior sonically !
Do you recall where you saw this discussed ? [/quote]

It's been some time, but probably over at AVS.

If you are using a single HDMI from the OPPO to the 976, can you get Dolby True and DTS Master with that connection?

Is the problem the same if you use the S/PDIF output of the disc player?

[/quote]


It's been some time, but probably over at AVS.

If you are using a single HDMI from the OPPO to the 976, can you get Dolby True and DTS Master with that connection? [/quote]

Yes, Ive watched a movie in DTS Master Audio 7.1 but have not tried True yet.

I *am* talking about the S/PDIF outputs, since there is typically no HDMI on CD players!

The problem exists with all these combinaisons :

CD-audio and CD-MP3 on a Tascam CD-200 CD player, connected by optical or coaxial.

CD-audio, CD-MP3 and files on a USB thumb drive, on a Yamaha BD-S677 connected by HDMI, optical or coaxial.

Any kind of files played on a MacBook Pro connected by the built-in optical output. Bluetooth seem OK with most mp3s (not all) but not with WAV/AIFF files.

DAT tapes on a Technics SV-DA10 connected by optical or coaxial. I'm not using the DAT daily (!) but decided to use it for the test.

Its very simple : as soon as a bitstream is interrupted and/or a digital silence is detected, the 976 will mute, and resume the next song with half a second fade-in. Which happens in between most every songs on most CDs.

A half-second is a long period of time for this discussion. It seems quicker than that to me, so many milliseconds. There is a very brief amount of time in between some tracks on the CDs I tried. Certain tracks that don't start as abruptly, it isn't noticeable at all. Other tracks on the same CD, the quick fade-in can be heard. I think it depends on the CD and how it's mastered, where the 976 loses the audio stream and has to reacquire the signal. I've had the same experience with a USB stick plugged into the Oppo.

I did hook up a stereo cable from my wireless OAW3 to one of the analog stereo connections and checked playing the same CDs and it's not evident at all.

I used this connection with my 975, from my PC to the Aux input (stereo analog). I upmix to all channel stereo. That served to bypass the issue with the 975, which was much more of an issue than with the 976. That will still be my connection of choice for music streaming with the 976.

Of course! This is a problem with a *digital* connection, not analog!

Also, I'm told that Oppo players won't trigger the issue.

Right, I was suggesting a work-around. IMO the 976 is much, much faster in acquisition time with detecting the digital signal than the 975 was.

Much faster, yes. But how about a goal of 0 delay? The 990 had no such delay, like I'm sure all external DACs have not. Could you imagine the outcry if an audiophile DAC costing over a grand had such an issue?

Sorry to be persistent about this, but I find this is a major flaw, and that a solution should be found and offered!

The functionalities and sound quality of the model 976 however are really great, and Outlaw should be lauded for that!

"Major Flaw"?? I wouldn't necessarily say it is major, although it could be somewhat annoying. The only way to fix it would be to introduce some sort of delay in the sensitivity of this feature. 5 seconds would probably do it. I would think that a FW update would be required but don't know how hard it would be to implement. I am also not sure why this doesn't happen in some pieces of gear.

I'm told that Oppo players outputs a constant bitstream even when there are gaps on the disc or between files.

What I wonder is why the fade-in is needed. Since the data are really there (in the duration of the fade-in), then why not let them play at full volume?

I don't have the issue with my OPPO BDP when playing a disc but then again I don't have a 976 either.

What disc player are you using? I tested my OPPO 205 as you requested awhile back at the AVS Forum owners thread using an optical connection and it was fine.

To the previous two posters, I said clearly that the Oppo players are **NOT** affected by this issue, hence you can't have the issue.

I also described the equipment I used to do tests just a few messages higher. I have the issue with a Tascam Cd-200, a Yamaha BD-S677 and a computer.

Sorry. I did not see your post about your equipment. No need to get mad. Just trying to help.

On some CDs, maybe 30% of them, the 976 will "lose the signal" in the silence between tracks, and when the next track begins, there is a short delay before the sound un-mute and resume with a fade-in, resulting in a loss of half the first second of the track. The same behavior is hapening when playing files on iTunes in a computer, via Bluetooth. I find this highly annoying. In pop/rock, it's often the first drums hit that is outright obliterated!

Deromax, I tried to duplicate this and could not. The only CD in your list that i own is Dire straits On every street. I played several tracks from it, and 5 other cd's, through the Marantz CDplayers coaxial digital out. I also used my Oppo players HDMI and analog outputs playing the same discs. I also tried bluetooth with my phones song playlist - nothing !
I have never heard this phenomenon you describe on anything i own !
Sorry, I do not have this problem - wish i could help !

I don't think it's a major flaw by any means. You already stated this is your first experience with an HDMI-based processor. IMO HDMI is primarily for HT applications, rather than music.
A solution is found and offered, which you haven't acknowledged reading. (my previous post) All the music you described, is PCM stereo coming in. Why not bring it in via the analog inputs. There are no issues with an analog connection. This is because a pre-pro or AV receiver will require a brief amount of time to detect the digital signal whenever the signal is momentarily lost.
Some of the latency may also be attributed to certain source devices. As you mention the Oppo I use handles this very well. This may not be true for all source devices.

The CD media, players and related equipment with S/PDIF inputs are in existance and working well toghether for the last 35 years. Except for HDMI equipment that seem different. So I considere this as a loss of basic functionality. You may think otherwise.

One of the goal of laying near a grand on a digital device is using it to its fullest. Using analog IN means bypassing the excellent DA converters I paid for, hence me not considereing analog IN as a suitable solution. YMMV.

I understand that we all have differing acceptance to this or that situation. Take that example : Some are complaining about the very bright blue Power button being a distraction. This is irrelevant to me because my gear is not visible from my couch so I never see it while watching a movie. I personnally think that this is proper home theater ergonomy but understand that other may like having their gear by their screen, so they are bothered by the bright light. Different strokes for different folks!

If I tell you to put a black tape over the bright light, yes it works, but is it an elegant solution for a high end product? This is the same thing as using an analog connexion to link two digital devices.

I may very well be in a small minority with this issue. I'm now realizing this. It looks like no solution will emerge here nor from Outlaw, so I'll work on workarounds by myself and suspend my discussing of this matter here before being ejected hahaha!!

Thanks all and have a nice holiday!

My wife made me wait until after Christmas to hook up my 976. Previously used a 950. With my 976, I've only been playing for 24 hours, but the following:

- the TRIGGER quit working within the first 12 hours - possibly due to turning on HDMI bypass, but flipping it back to off, doesn't seem to matter. I have confirmed TRIGGERS are ON in the INPUT SETUP. For now, I'll just let the AMP (Outlaw 7700) stay on all the time - pulled the trigger wire.

- My amp (Outlaw 7700) uses RCA connectors - I am using RCA cables with PCA connectors from Outlaw that have tightening ends - with the density of the connectors on the 976, it is nearly impossible to tighten or loosen these RCA connectors.

- the REMOTE has a nice heft, but the lack of button sizing has me counting - to get volume, count 3/4 button first column up from the bottom. Not really what I would consider user friendly. While I am okay counting, my wife is going to find that just plain dumb.

- the BRIGHT BLUE power button overwhelms. My equipment is near the TV and the power button is just simply too bright (whatever happened to the green power button, which is much easier on the eyes)...

- seems I have to push the remote buttons twice frequently to get anything to happen. I'm not sure if it is just me. The equipment is out in the open.

Will contact support in a couple weeks as I learn more... ordered a couple short HDMI to clean up the install

Outlaw 976 / Outlaw 770
Pioneer Elite PRO-950HD Plasma
Klipsch RS7 sides & backs
Klipsch RC7 center
Klipsch Forte fronts
Klipsch RSW12 sub
Sony BDP-S301
Motorola DCH6416

The trigger issue hasn't shown up before. Check the cable to make sure it isn't bad and that it is fully inserted on both ends.

Did you do this on each input, in the input setup? Please note the triggers are input specific. Have you checked your cable for continuity or tried another 1/8" mono cable?



Drue from the forum also contacted me about this. I would note this is normal for the surr mode button as well as the TEST button. The first press of the surr mode button shows the current incoming format, a second press is needed to change post processing modes (if applicable). The first press of the TEST button bring up the option of having test tone on or off while adjusting channel levels, and so a selection is needed before proceeding.

Outside of this, I would note that Plasmas are known for IR interference and it seems both you and Drue are using them. If it is interfering with the Outlaw remote, I would bet you are probably getting shorter working range as well? The remotes are tested to work over 20ft away and 45 degrees off axis.