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#96915 - 09/25/17 07:58 AM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: mdanderson]
renov8r Offline
Desperado

Registered: 11/13/02
Posts: 336
Loc: Illinois
Originally Posted By mdanderson
I wonder if Outlaw is working on their upcoming object based prepro at the same time they are working on the 976. I previously mentioned that the 976 would be the one for me since I saw no way I could do Atmos(using on or in-ceiling speakers) in my apartment, but I am now thinking about waiting on their Atmos prepro because I ordered some Atmos enabled speakers that I am going to try out next weekend. If I have success with them, then I may just wait on the Outlaw object based prepro or even consider the Marantz AV7703 which Outlaw is selling. If I don't have success with the Atmos enabled speakers then the 976 would be my choice.


That makes lots of sense. Fact is there are some very nice up-firing Atmos speakers as well as add-ons (including a pair from Atlantic Technology...) that are absolutely perfect for many apartment dwellers. Folks should not have any reluctance about using up-firing Atmos speakers in situations where they are appropriate -- that generally covers homes and apartments with normal ceiling height & construction where the up-firing speakers can be placed atop floor standers / bookshelf units on stands...

I suspect that much of the tech for the 976 is similar to the design for the "object pre-pro" but the Outlaws have enough experience to hold their cards close to the vest when it comes to specific manufacturing details, as prior efforts have steps on too many toes...

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#96916 - 09/25/17 12:46 PM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: TCat]
Owl's_Warder Offline
Desperado

Registered: 06/29/01
Posts: 894
Loc: Grants Pass, OR
Originally Posted By TCat
...the response to that, here, was generally in the "White Knight" form of "You just don't understand", rather than of "Hmm... yeah, that is pretty bad, what's with that?" or similar.
Owl is correct; I was using the term "club" in the same way I used "White Knight" a few sentences ago... I'm not aware of any blessings and bestowing of swords. cool My point was this...

Read the entire thread, along with the 976 Anticipation Thread. All of each. The statement in January was "Spring 2017", which initially people (perhaps optimistically) expected to be in middish-Spring.

It's now Autumn. Summer is gone. And there hasn't been much status or updates. Yes, a dribble of perhaps two messages. But nearly nothing. Meanwhile, not Outlaw's problem, but for example, I actually moved in March. So for me "Spring" was a relevant timeframe; waiting through June knowing an end is in-sight is radically different than, more than six months later, still having vague, but unmet, promises.


Thanks for a thoughtful post, TCat! It's nice to finally see where your frustrations are coming from. I can certainly understand, given your situation, why you're dismayed by the lack of communication from the Outlaws.

As I (and others) have mentioned before, there was a time when they were much more open about what was happening and what they anticipated for release schedules. However, after one particularly nasty bout of problems caused a previous processor to be delayed a few times and then scrapped, the ensuing backlash caused them to change to a much more closed off approach. If you look at their product announcements and releases since that time, they have been pretty much right on. They announce, provide a date within a couple months, and then start shipping on time. The fact that the 976 hasn't met this pattern suggests to me that there is a completely unforeseen issue that has cropped up.

Now to take your position, yes, I agree it'd be awesome if they'd fill us in on what that delay is, or at least when it will be resolved. They seem to still be a bit gun shy, though and having been around for that fallout, I can't really say I blame them. Personally, I think they swung too far back on the pendulum from transparent all the way to brick wall. It'd be nice if they can find a middle ground that we can all live with, maybe a nice wooden fence with some missing knotholes we can peek through to see inside the corral.

All of that said, I understand where they're coming from and know that this is the way they operate. I accept the situation and my expectations are tempered accordingly. I freely acknowledge that's easy for me to do since I'm watching from an interested position vs. a need position, though.

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#96917 - 09/25/17 01:37 PM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: ppellegrini]
Hank Offline
Desperado

Registered: 03/30/01
Posts: 348
Loc: Austin, Texas, USA
+1 Yes, the Outlaws are gun-shy after the bashing received from missing out on the 978 (?). They were bullied out of their China outsource mfgr by a much larger company that also was developing pre/pros. After missing Estimated ship dates (which fans self-interpreted as Promised ship dates)and then having to cancel the product, the backlash Owl's_Warder alludes to was stinging. And, as has been pointed out repeatedly, The Outlaws care about customer loyalty, trust and service, so they "...swung too far back on the pendulum..."

Outlaws: time for beta testing?
_________________________
"Do you expect me to talk?"
"No Mr. Bond, I expect you to die!"

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#96918 - 09/25/17 05:52 PM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: ppellegrini]
J.H. Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 04/03/06
Posts: 43
Loc: NJ
I don't have a lot of confidence about this processor ever coming to the market after reading the 4 or 5 posts.

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#96919 - 09/25/17 08:49 PM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: ppellegrini]
Owl's_Warder Offline
Desperado

Registered: 06/29/01
Posts: 894
Loc: Grants Pass, OR
I'm of the impression that beta testing was already done? When they announced a spring ship, I figured they were just implementing the fixes on things that showed up in beta and maybe ironing out any last minute licensing issues. Given that the product was much closer to market than the scrapped pre/pro, I'm confident the 976 is going to come out, J.H. I'm hopeful for the holiday season but only the Outlaws know for sure. smile

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#96920 - 09/25/17 09:05 PM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: ppellegrini]
JDB001 Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 09/10/01
Posts: 51
Loc: Seneca, SC
tick - tock -- tick -- tock -- tick tock -- and the faithful wait -- yes we wait


Edited by JDB001 (09/25/17 09:06 PM)

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#96921 - 09/26/17 12:09 AM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: renov8r]
mdanderson Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 04/14/01
Posts: 161
Loc: Garland,Tx. USA
Originally Posted By renov8r
Originally Posted By mdanderson
I wonder if Outlaw is working on their upcoming object based prepro at the same time they are working on the 976. I previously mentioned that the 976 would be the one for me since I saw no way I could do Atmos(using on or in-ceiling speakers) in my apartment, but I am now thinking about waiting on their Atmos prepro because I ordered some Atmos enabled speakers that I am going to try out next weekend. If I have success with them, then I may just wait on the Outlaw object based prepro or even consider the Marantz AV7703 which Outlaw is selling. If I don't have success with the Atmos enabled speakers then the 976 would be my choice.


That makes lots of sense. Fact is there are some very nice up-firing Atmos speakers as well as add-ons (including a pair from Atlantic Technology...) that are absolutely perfect for many apartment dwellers. Folks should not have any reluctance about using up-firing Atmos speakers in situations where they are appropriate -- that generally covers homes and apartments with normal ceiling height & construction where the up-firing speakers can be placed atop floor standers / bookshelf units on stands...

I suspect that much of the tech for the 976 is similar to the design for the "object pre-pro" but the Outlaws have enough experience to hold their cards close to the vest when it comes to specific manufacturing details, as prior efforts have steps on too many toes...


Thanks for your input on this subject. I am really excited about getting Atmos to work for me but not getting my hopes up too much. I have a rather small living room(13.5 x 14ft) with a standard 8ft flat ceiling. It would really be cool if the Outlaw object based prepro had a room correction system included. It will be hard to give up Audyssey in my Marantz but at least the Outlaw will have a PEQ with it.
_________________________
Paradigm Studio 20v5-fronts
Paradigm Studio CC-490v5-center
Paradigm Studio 10v5- side surrounds,Monitor surround 3v7-bck surr
Oppo UDP-205/LG 65C6
Outlaw 976 prepro/ Emotiva BasX A-700 amp
Power Sound Audio 15S

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#96924 - 09/26/17 08:52 PM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: ppellegrini]
Helson Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 03/21/12
Posts: 283
Loc: USA
I was trying to find a post about the pre-pro being 99% done some time ago, with just that pesky 1% left to hurdle, but I'm having trouble locating it. and please don't tell me its an earlier post in this thread.:)
Anyway I'm still hopefully waiting. My 975 is still going well, but I need to set up my system for full 4k. Don't think I'll be doing immersive, but I won't say never.
_________________________
Main HT <> 976 <> 7200 <> Ultra-X12 <> sapphire ST2 mkII RF/LF <> sapphire SC center
sapphire ST2 mkII SBR/SBL <> sapphire SS SR/SL <> Verizon/DVR <> Vizio M70Q7 <> Oppo UDP-203 <> Amazon 4k Fire TV

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#96925 - 09/26/17 08:56 PM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: admin]
Helson Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 03/21/12
Posts: 283
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By admin
Fellow Outlaws:

We know that you are anxious to get your hands on the forthcoming Model 976, and we are just as anxious to get it to you.

That said, given the date, it is obvious that it will ship a bit later than we had hoped. There is a continual battle to find the balance between pre-announcing new products, as we did for the Model 976 versus waiting to announce them until the are ready to ship, as we did with the RR 2160 and Ultra X13. Regardless, whenever we announce a new product it is very important to us that any new product ships only when it is ready, not before. We're not quite at that point yet for the Model 976

It's been said that it's "The first 99% is easy. It's the last 1% that is the hardest." That is a good summary of where we are. We have units under test that are completely functional and which deliver outstanding audio and video performance. We've completed work with Room EQ Wizard that is optimized for the Model 976. We have the parts staged and ready for production start. That's the "99%".

Unfortunately, there is that remaining 1%. There are a few remaining issues that have cropped up that we are simply not comfortable having in a production product. None, by themselves, are fatal. However, collectively they would prevent the Model 976 from meeting our expectations. Yes, it will take until after our goal of "before the end of spring" to work all of this out. Since some of these things are interdependent it is to say how long it will take, but it shouldn't be that long.

Again, thanks for your support, patience and understanding as we work to bring you the product you expect and deserve.
Yup, earlier in this thread. Should have looked here first.
_________________________
Main HT <> 976 <> 7200 <> Ultra-X12 <> sapphire ST2 mkII RF/LF <> sapphire SC center
sapphire ST2 mkII SBR/SBL <> sapphire SS SR/SL <> Verizon/DVR <> Vizio M70Q7 <> Oppo UDP-203 <> Amazon 4k Fire TV

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#96926 - 09/27/17 10:05 AM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: ppellegrini]
975 destroyer Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 09/07/15
Posts: 129
Loc: Georgia, US of A!
Would you want pork or chicken before (160-165 internal temp) it was ready? The finishing touches on a sub or RR2260 pale next to getting ALL of an AVR's or prepro's DSP bug-free.

Hang in there, the "Destroyer"


Edited by 975 destroyer (09/27/17 10:09 AM)

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