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#96974 - 10/14/17 11:40 AM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: Cadboy64]
TCat Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 03/25/17
Posts: 22
Loc: PNW
Originally Posted By Cadboy64
Originally Posted By J.H.
Wow getting close. I was dead set on getting one, but I'm kinda thinking of starting to upgrade my speakers from Def Tech to Ascend Acoustics. That has NOTHING to do with the delay. I wasn't buying till December anyway. Just something I got in my head to upgrade speakers to much more high end. What to do?


Having owned Ascend Acoustics Sierra-2's since they were released I have not had the urge to "Upgrade". They are that stinkin' good. The only upgrade that ever enters my head would be moving to the Sierra towers W/RAAL tweeters, but I am not in any hurry to replace the Sierra-2's.

Having said that, I've never owned Def Tech but have heard those that have gone from them to Ascend have been very happy. YMMV.

Not making a judgement on Ascend, but of course people are almost always happy with their newest purchase. Their ego is vested in validating their newest expense.

The best speakers depend so much on the usage, the space and on what you personally like. I like rich enveloping surround sound where the audio engineer's work is as valued as the cinematographer's. I'm not big into appreciating "stereo" music; it doesn't exist in real life and I seldom take an hour to focus solely on the music in a sweet spot.

I do have a rather purist friend, purist in many ways. Makes him excellent on projects when a team is built with his skills in mind, but often rather hard to integrate into one. His audio preference really is to sit in his sweet spot recliner, nobody talking, and just "listen". He needs a different system.

I have Def Tech bipolars all around. Powered LCR (integrated subs.) Additional rear subs. All sonically matched. They sound amazing, the result is a near-sweet-spot through out a huge space. Properly mixed music - I have a bunch of DTS - is astonishingly good, as are movies - no matter where you are, you know about where the sound was meant to come from.

But it's chaotic to my friend. I suspect it's not orderly enough for his preferences. Bipolars aren't what he wants. For that kind of noise, he'd prefer to go to a theatre, where I suspect his mindset allows it to be okay.

Of course Def Tech makes a wide variety of sound systems. I don't like the Mythos line at all, but I also don't like Bose or B&O. My point after all this rambling and detail is, sometimes the type of speakers matter more than the brand of speakers, to match your needs.

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#96975 - 10/14/17 04:13 PM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: TCat]
AvFan Offline
Desperado

Registered: 09/12/05
Posts: 619
Loc: El Cajon, California
Originally Posted By TCat
Originally Posted By Cadboy64
Originally Posted By J.H.
Wow getting close. I was dead set on getting one, but I'm kinda thinking of starting to upgrade my speakers from Def Tech to Ascend Acoustics. That has NOTHING to do with the delay. I wasn't buying till December anyway. Just something I got in my head to upgrade speakers to much more high end. What to do?


Having owned Ascend Acoustics Sierra-2's since they were released I have not had the urge to "Upgrade". They are that stinkin' good. The only upgrade that ever enters my head would be moving to the Sierra towers W/RAAL tweeters, but I am not in any hurry to replace the Sierra-2's.

Having said that, I've never owned Def Tech but have heard those that have gone from them to Ascend have been very happy. YMMV.

Not making a judgement on Ascend, but of course people are almost always happy with their newest purchase. Their ego is vested in validating their newest expense.

The best speakers depend so much on the usage, the space and on what you personally like. I like rich enveloping surround sound where the audio engineer's work is as valued as the cinematographer's. I'm not big into appreciating "stereo" music; it doesn't exist in real life and I seldom take an hour to focus solely on the music in a sweet spot.

I do have a rather purist friend, purist in many ways. Makes him excellent on projects when a team is built with his skills in mind, but often rather hard to integrate into one. His audio preference really is to sit in his sweet spot recliner, nobody talking, and just "listen". He needs a different system.

I have Def Tech bipolars all around. Powered LCR (integrated subs.) Additional rear subs. All sonically matched. They sound amazing, the result is a near-sweet-spot through out a huge space. Properly mixed music - I have a bunch of DTS - is astonishingly good, as are movies - no matter where you are, you know about where the sound was meant to come from.

But it's chaotic to my friend. I suspect it's not orderly enough for his preferences. Bipolars aren't what he wants. For that kind of noise, he'd prefer to go to a theatre, where I suspect his mindset allows it to be okay.

Of course Def Tech makes a wide variety of sound systems. I don't like the Mythos line at all, but I also don't like Bose or B&O. My point after all this rambling and detail is, sometimes the type of speakers matter more than the brand of speakers, to match your needs.


TCat: I don't pretend to be a Saloon moderator and I really don't get into tit-for-tat discussions on forums, but geez, it seems all your posts are thread craps. How folks spend their money is their business and none of mine or yours. If someone invites Saloon member's opinions on a product that is different. J.H. was really just asking whether to wait for the 976 or buy new speakers. So the first two sentences of your post frustrated me. Now if J.H. did get new Ascend speakers he may now read your post and doubt his purchase because you stated "...ego is vested in validating their newest expense." You leave no room for the possibility his new speakers really are better than what he had before. I also don't think the rest of your post added to the discussion Cadboy64 and J.H were having. IMO when someone shells out their hard-earned money It is better to be supportive or say nothing. Lecture over.
_________________________
AvFan
Outlaw 976 | ATI 2005 | M&K 850s Left, Center & Right, Surround-55s, MX-70B Sub | Harmony 950 remote | Panamax 5100 | OPPO UDP-203 | LG OLED55B7

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#96976 - 10/14/17 06:11 PM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: AvFan]
TCat Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 03/25/17
Posts: 22
Loc: PNW
Originally Posted By AvFan
Originally Posted By TCat

Not making a judgement on Ascend, but of course people are almost always happy with their newest purchase. Their ego is vested in validating their newest expense.
...

...
IMO when someone shells out their hard-earned money It is better to be supportive or say nothing. Lecture over.

I wasn't dissing the Ascend speakers, nor any purchase of them. And, as he hasn't purchased them, your final sentence (your "attitude:, quoted above) doesn't apply. Rather it precisely validates my statement, although perhaps merely because nobody will speak up otherwise... especially you, who would prefer to impose your own self-censorship on others including me.

If you don't allow for differences of opinions between people who have bought different things, what are you doing to the flow of information?

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#96977 - 10/14/17 10:00 PM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: ppellegrini]
J.H. Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 04/03/06
Posts: 43
Loc: NJ
Well thanks for the posts. I think I'm gonna hold off on speakers and get the 976, and the Oppo 203 to set myself up for eventually moving to 4K. My Def Techs really do sound great despite the reputation DT has in inflating specs. I think this is the right path. I really do want the 976. Lets see the buy button now on the website, lets get some reviews.

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#96978 - 10/14/17 11:11 PM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: J.H.]
butchgo Offline
Desperado

Registered: 06/22/07
Posts: 368
Loc: Southern Oregon coast
Originally Posted By J.H.
Well thanks for the posts. I think I'm gonna hold off on speakers and get the 976, and the Oppo 203 to set myself up for eventually moving to 4K. My Def Techs really do sound great despite the reputation DT has in inflating specs. I think this is the right path. I really do want the 976. Lets see the buy button now on the website, lets get some reviews.

I 2nd that.
Get the pre-order page up already!!!!!
_________________________
Epson 3500 3D projector
93" Carl's Place Flexiwhite DIY screen
Outlaw 976 Pre/Pro
Outlaw 7500 for LCR & L/R surrounds
1- Emotiva Mini X-A100 for rear surrounds
2- Outlaw LFM-1 EX subs
Oppo BDP-105 Blu-ray/DVD/SACD player
Outlaw LCR (Snell Labs) for center channel duty
Tekton Enzo XL L/R
4- Emotiva ERD-1s surround speakers
Monster HTS3600MKII power center

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#96979 - 10/14/17 11:21 PM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: J.H.]
AvFan Offline
Desperado

Registered: 09/12/05
Posts: 619
Loc: El Cajon, California
Originally Posted By J.H.
Well thanks for the posts. I think I'm gonna hold off on speakers and get the 976, and the Oppo 203 to set myself up for eventually moving to 4K. My Def Techs really do sound great despite the reputation DT has in inflating specs. I think this is the right path. I really do want the 976. Lets see the buy button now on the website, lets get some reviews.


I'm doing much the same staying with my M&Ks but I can't help but look at OLED TVs, new remotes and Apple TV to go along with the Oppo UDP-203 and 976. I would really like to do a complete system upgrade given the age and technology of my current system.
_________________________
AvFan
Outlaw 976 | ATI 2005 | M&K 850s Left, Center & Right, Surround-55s, MX-70B Sub | Harmony 950 remote | Panamax 5100 | OPPO UDP-203 | LG OLED55B7

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#96981 - 10/15/17 07:30 AM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: AvFan]
J.H. Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 04/03/06
Posts: 43
Loc: NJ
Originally Posted By AvFan
Originally Posted By J.H.
Well thanks for the posts. I think I'm gonna hold off on speakers and get the 976, and the Oppo 203 to set myself up for eventually moving to 4K. My Def Techs really do sound great despite the reputation DT has in inflating specs. I think this is the right path. I really do want the 976. Lets see the buy button now on the website, lets get some reviews.


I'm doing much the same staying with my M&Ks but I can't help but look at OLED TVs, new remotes and Apple TV to go along with the Oppo UDP-203 and 976. I would really like to do a complete system upgrade given the age and technology of my current system.


Yeah I really had my heart set on the 976 for long time now so I will stick with that. So the 976 and the Oppo is a good start on my way to 4K. The speakers I have are really good.

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#96984 - 10/16/17 10:20 AM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: TCat]
Cadboy64 Offline
Deputy Gunslinger

Registered: 03/02/12
Posts: 13
Loc: Near Cleveland, OH
Originally Posted By TCat
Originally Posted By Cadboy64
Originally Posted By J.H.
Wow getting close. I was dead set on getting one, but I'm kinda thinking of starting to upgrade my speakers from Def Tech to Ascend Acoustics. That has NOTHING to do with the delay. I wasn't buying till December anyway. Just something I got in my head to upgrade speakers to much more high end. What to do?


Having owned Ascend Acoustics Sierra-2's since they were released I have not had the urge to "Upgrade". They are that stinkin' good. The only upgrade that ever enters my head would be moving to the Sierra towers W/RAAL tweeters, but I am not in any hurry to replace the Sierra-2's.

Having said that, I've never owned Def Tech but have heard those that have gone from them to Ascend have been very happy. YMMV.

Not making a judgement on Ascend, but of course people are almost always happy with their newest purchase. Their ego is vested in validating their newest expense.

The best speakers depend so much on the usage, the space and on what you personally like. I like rich enveloping surround sound where the audio engineer's work is as valued as the cinematographer's. I'm not big into appreciating "stereo" music; it doesn't exist in real life and I seldom take an hour to focus solely on the music in a sweet spot.

I do have a rather purist friend, purist in many ways. Makes him excellent on projects when a team is built with his skills in mind, but often rather hard to integrate into one. His audio preference really is to sit in his sweet spot recliner, nobody talking, and just "listen". He needs a different system.

I have Def Tech bipolars all around. Powered LCR (integrated subs.) Additional rear subs. All sonically matched. They sound amazing, the result is a near-sweet-spot through out a huge space. Properly mixed music - I have a bunch of DTS - is astonishingly good, as are movies - no matter where you are, you know about where the sound was meant to come from.

But it's chaotic to my friend. I suspect it's not orderly enough for his preferences. Bipolars aren't what he wants. For that kind of noise, he'd prefer to go to a theatre, where I suspect his mindset allows it to be okay.

Of course Def Tech makes a wide variety of sound systems. I don't like the Mythos line at all, but I also don't like Bose or B&O. My point after all this rambling and detail is, sometimes the type of speakers matter more than the brand of speakers, to match your needs.


Not trying to steer this thread off course, but....
I agree, people need to validate their purchases. Some will do so despite feeling they made the wrong choice but don't want to bruise their egos by admitting to it. I have played the upgrade game as long as I've been in this hobby dating back to 1984. I've had a number of speakers including models from Design Acoustics, Infinity, Vandersteen, B&W, and cureently Ascend acoustics. I will not hold on to a speaker if I am not satisfied with it. I took a chance on Ascend Acoustics back when their only model was the CBM-170 2-way monitor. It surprised me and replaced a pair of B&W 602's. When the first Sierra-1 was introduced I jumped onboard and sold the 170's. I was thrilled with the Sierra-1's. After a few years I felt more detail in the tweeter would be nice, and upgraded my pair with the NrT upgrade kits. That was a nice, noticeable change in the highs. Lots of detail and impact with the mids pulled more forward. These things rocked! Then, Ascend just HAD TO develop the RAAL Ribbon tweeter in the new tower. That led to them developing a custom RAAL for the Sierra-2 along with a new woofer designed specifically to mesh with it. They announced the upgrade kits for the Sierra-2 and I did not hesitate to purchase a pair of kits. I have upgraded the Sierra's twice rather than feel the need to seek out another brand, or even feel the urge to change them. Like I said, the only upgrade I would consider would be moving to the RAAL towers. The Sierra-2's paired to my Rythmik sub never make me feel like changing them out.

Ok, enough of this "rant"! Bottom line: Listen to as many speakers as possible IN YOUR HOME and keep the ones that make you smile!

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#96986 - 10/16/17 11:52 AM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: renov8r]
Owl's_Warder Offline
Desperado

Registered: 06/29/01
Posts: 894
Loc: Grants Pass, OR
Originally Posted By renov8r
HDMI 2.0b is the current "latest and greatest" -- the major issue is that the inclusion of "Hybrid Log Gamma" info -- https://www.cnet.com/how-to/what-is-hdmi-2-0b/

The "big deal" with HLG is that it allows for LIVE HDR content which is what will be needed for things like SPORTS, though given the fact that pretty much EVERY sporting event since TV has been around is massively saturated in artificial lighting I wonder if this is a misguided effort... http://www.trustedreviews.com/opinion/hybrid-log-gamma-what-is-it-2947378 That being said since HLG is an official ATSC standard it is important -- http://www.wow.com/wiki/Hybrid_Log-Gamma

Don't confuse HDMI 2.1 (which is on the horizon) for HDCP 2.2 -- basically the copy protection scheme has been around long enough (four years??) that it too is the current standard BUT there is a looming revision that could be called HDCP 2.3 -- https://www.digital-cp.com/sites/default...erReview_v1.pdf


Aye. I was just reading this article (and a couple others like it) so it seems that 2.1 is pretty much here. The first 2.1 cables are already being sold and have been doing so for about a month now. AVR's are expected to start shipping with 2.1 within the next few months, possibly even this year.

I doubt very much that Outlaw would be delaying the 976 for the inclusion of HDMI 2.1, but there's the chance that they're taking advantage of the delay and adding it. I can't imagine they'd be unhappy to be one of the first to market with 2.1.

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#96988 - 10/17/17 07:02 AM Re: Model 976 - myth or real? [Re: ppellegrini]
rance Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 06/09/04
Posts: 99
Loc: Boston. MA
I loved my 950, I love my 990, and I'm sure I'll love the 976. My optimism was dwindling as time passed after the death of the 978 (or was it the 997? 998? I can't remember), but now, finally, it's almost here. My 990 is still serving me well, but the thought of connecting all my devices without using the funky connections I have now has got me a little woozy with anticipation!

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