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#34774 - 05/23/04 12:39 PM Re: LFM-1 vs. SVS PB1-ISD Please Help!
gonk Offline
Desperado

Registered: 03/21/01
Posts: 14054
Loc: Memphis, TN USA
I don't know if I've said it in this thread or now, but if you are considering subs that can be demo'ed locally, definitely make the rounds and listen to some of them. Also, when reading online reviews (or recommendations from anyone in an online forum), it's important to remember their perspective. There is a strong bias in favor of SVS in the online community. At times, that bias may sway people to feeling that an SVS sub is better than a competitor when it may not be. We all will tend to overlay some bias in favor of what we've used and been happy with, whether that's my satisfaction with Paradigm and Outlaw or curegeorg's fondness for Velodyne. Go out and do some listening, see what you like - it may help draw parallels with other products that you haven't heard.

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gonk -- 950 Review | LFM-1 Review | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | Saloon Links
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#34775 - 05/24/04 04:52 PM Re: LFM-1 vs. SVS PB1-ISD Please Help!
Spiker Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 05/29/03
Posts: 297
Loc: Middle Earth
Quote:
Originally posted by curegeorg:
It is hard to sum up what makes a subwoofer good, because lots of the qualities go hand in hand.


Seems to me, if one decides to follow your advice, he or she must consider the reality of sub evaluation which is not a clean cut decision. It seems easy in theory but to actually pick one or two in the store or internet, I’m not sure if I can say one sub is twice as good or one and a half times as good or just 50 % better even though costs twice as much and … etc.
For the sake of helping other gunslingers who are thinking about using 2 subs, would you list some of subs that may only be half as good as lets say LFM-1 and why? That way, those subs and the lesser ones can be avoided.

Now, if one decides to follow soundhound’s advice on using 2 subs, the worries will be on something else which I think he has posted a lengthy info on that last year.

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#34776 - 05/24/04 09:47 PM Re: LFM-1 vs. SVS PB1-ISD Please Help!
JT Clark Offline
Desperado

Registered: 10/25/02
Posts: 466
Loc: IL
The speaker makes many times the difference the amp will. It is possible to get a very good idea of what a sub will sound like if you have the right specs. These are pretty much never listed for HT subs though. I know of these specs, but I'm not an expert on reading them. Just trying to guess by things like amp power, manufacturer rated frequency response, and how the sub is put together (ie ported, downfiring, etc) is next to useless.

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#34777 - 05/25/04 09:38 AM Re: LFM-1 vs. SVS PB1-ISD Please Help!
curegeorg Offline
Desperado

Registered: 11/15/03
Posts: 1012
Loc: Raleigh, North Carolina, USA
Quote:
Originally posted by tas:
curegeorg,

what else would you recommend other than velodyne, any experience or info on Earthquake subs?


yes i demod some before i got my stuff years ago. they were ok, but they are overpriced for what you get. for the money that they want, you can find MUCH nicer subs.
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#34778 - 05/25/04 09:41 AM Re: LFM-1 vs. SVS PB1-ISD Please Help!
curegeorg Offline
Desperado

Registered: 11/15/03
Posts: 1012
Loc: Raleigh, North Carolina, USA
Quote:
Originally posted by Spiker:
Seems to me, if one decides to follow your advice, he or she must consider the reality of sub evaluation which is not a clean cut decision. It seems easy in theory but to actually pick one or two in the store or internet, I’m not sure if I can say one sub is twice as good or one and a half times as good or just 50 % better even though costs twice as much and … etc.
For the sake of helping other gunslingers who are thinking about using 2 subs, would you list some of subs that may only be half as good as lets say LFM-1 and why? That way, those subs and the lesser ones can be avoided.

Now, if one decides to follow soundhound’s advice on using 2 subs, the worries will be on something else which I think he has posted a lengthy info on that last year.


so you want a sub that is half as good as the lfm1 or HALF THE PRICE? or do you want half as good and half as expensive?
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#34779 - 05/25/04 12:11 PM Re: LFM-1 vs. SVS PB1-ISD Please Help!
Spiker Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 05/29/03
Posts: 297
Loc: Middle Earth
Quote:
Originally posted by curegeorg:
so you want a sub that is half as good as the lfm1 or HALF THE PRICE? or do you want half as good and half as expensive?


I wrote “That way, those subs and the lesser ones can be avoided”.

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#34780 - 06/07/04 03:37 PM Re: LFM-1 vs. SVS PB1-ISD Please Help!
lotus_j Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 06/18/02
Posts: 50
Loc: Outside
First off, I'll make a statement:

SVS does inhouse design their subs.

Second, I'll state VELODYNE SUCKS.

Its my opinion, and I think my opinion is at least as important as Curegeorg's. Also I don't think SVS is all that either. I've heard their fancy expensive one and I'd sooner buy a depth or something with musical bass and a lack of boominess.

I've only heard an LFM-1 a couple times, but imho it blows away most of the competition that is priced up to twice as much. Most, but not all.

There are so many things that can effect bass that weren't mentioned like cabinetry, etc. I've never been able to make a decision about a speaker or sub by looking at specs. I've been fooled too many times by specs.

You really have to LISTEN to a sub, just like a speaker. You have to decide what sounds better to YOUR ear. Don't listen to internet guys about speakers. Whatever they own, the love for the most part, and some will bash any other product.

SVS is a brand I would never offer anyone to criticize to loudly online. You will get wrongly attacked.

Facts are, every speaker/sub has its own musical note so to speak.

Make your own decisions and I'd suggest LISTENING to subs, with your own kind of music, in an environment that best suits you:

HOME.

Outlaw will accept returns and any high end audio store will let you take a demo home if they are decent. In fact most manufacturers of high end equipment demand their dealers allow just that. If a dealer won't let you take one home, email the manufacturer and see what they suggest.

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#34781 - 06/07/04 05:57 PM Re: LFM-1 vs. SVS PB1-ISD Please Help!
readster Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 01/31/04
Posts: 81
Loc: Bartlesville, OK USA
i dont think you can get a sub as good as the spl even with 2 lfms. you yourself say 700 online for spl1200, that is not much more than the lfm anyway.

Curegeorge, is a funny guy. I've read alot of his posts, and I kinda think he just likes to argue. However, I can tell you from experience of owning an LFM-1, that is does blow away alot of the more expensive subs, and two does definately make a difference in the volume of bass as well as the low extension. I would audition as many subs as i could, but you will never go wrong with the LFM-1, it's an incredible sub.

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#34782 - 06/07/04 10:26 PM Re: LFM-1 vs. SVS PB1-ISD Please Help!
Avi Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 04/30/01
Posts: 62
Loc: Northern New Jersey, USA
There's another reason to go with dual subs: depending on your room and placement, you may get smoother response without equalization.

FWIW, I just ordered a pair of LFM-1s as the first step in a major gear upgrade - pretty much everything is getting replaced. I do this for a living (see http://www.hometheaterwatch.com), so there's a good chance something better will come along on a "long term loan" or "review unit pricing" that will eventually replace them. But in the meantime, the LFM-1 was impressive enough at the HES show in NY with material I know well -- and inexpensive enough -- for me to pull out my credit card. My review of the show will be up on Secrets shortly(http://www.hometheaterhifi.com).

-avi
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Regular home theater / consumer electronics column posted at http://www.greengart.com .

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#34783 - 06/08/04 12:20 AM Re: LFM-1 vs. SVS PB1-ISD Please Help!
curegeorg Offline
Desperado

Registered: 11/15/03
Posts: 1012
Loc: Raleigh, North Carolina, USA
not me, im not argumentative... :-) no doubt the lfm is a good sub for its price. and if there was nothing priced above it, then it would be the best. however there is, and its not.

i think velodynes value is surpassed in their lower end models by companies such as svs, outlaw, etc. which have a different process of selling (i.e. internet direct) and can afford to sell their products directly and make more money per sub, while still having a lower cost to the consumer.

having said that, i doubt there are very many if any (i havent heard any in 20 years) better than velodynes top models at their price range let alone anything anywhere near their price. i doubt that there is any sub available better than the 1812.

you have to compare apples to apples to even compare anything at all.

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This post has been brought to you by curegeorg, thanks for reading.
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This post has been brought to you by curegeorg, thanks for reading.

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