Bitstream problem

I need help trying to diagnose a problem that I encounter just recently. I watched John Wick on Bluray this last weekend and the audio was a mess. The audio was cutting in and out like the Outlaw had trouble either locking down the bitstream or decoding it. I believe that John Wick is a Dolby Atmos encode, now i don't know if that causes a problem or not. I have an Oppo 83 as my bluray player and I've also contacted them to help me narrow down this problem. My Oppo is conected directly to the Outlaw via HDMI.

A couple of things I tried with no success and a resolution I found worked but not ideal. The first thing i tried was a complete power cycle of my components, that didn't work. I also tried 3 different HDMI cables also with no success. I did find a work around by having the Oppo decode the signal and send PCM audio,via HDMI, to the Outlaw. It's a solution just not ideal for me.

I believe I have the lastest firmware for the Outlaw. Is there anything else I could try for a solution or has anyone experienced this before? Or is this solely an Oppo problem?
Thanks in advance,
Jason

I'm fairly certain that unless you have a processor that supports Dolby Atmos, you will have to set the Oppo to output PCM. The 975 obviously isn't Atmos capable.

Since neither the BDP-83 or the 975 are Atmos enabled I think PCM is the only way to get the signal to the 975 for processing although from what I have read the OPPO should be able to decode the 7.1 stream.

Here's the explanation:
The Atmos titles have 7.1 THD audio and use a complex seamless branching protection scheme. The audio dropout issues are the result of that combination and have nothing to do with the Atmos encoding. The BDP-83 is actually quite capable of bitstreaming Atmos audio in its 7.1 THD wrapper. Without getting too far into the technical reasons for this issue, suffice it to say that 7.1 THD requires more processing power to bitstream when combined with the complex seamless branching, and many older players don't have the poop to handle it. Think: buffering issues. DTS-MA 7.1 does not create these problems even with complex seamless branching.

If you have the capability to rip a BD and eliminate the seamless branching - burn that to a BD-R and the Oppo should handle it fine. The Oppo 93 has the same problem, the newer 103/103D do not since they have a dual-core chip and more memory.

Thanks for the responses, especially since I haven't heard back from my Oppo inquiry. So just to clarify for my own understanding. Due to new protection schemes the Oppo is unable to bitstream the Dolby TrueHD signal to my Outlaw? So there is no problem with my Outlaw, sigh of relief. The work around of have it decode the signal then send LPCM to my Outlaw, as of now, is the only working solution. Unless I get a new BD player. Which I will do, once the 4K standard has been finalized and Oppo releases a new player for that standard. Unfortunately i can not rip BD to eliminate the branching. However this brings up a new concern. Is this new scheme going to affect the other codecs and cause problems? Or is it just going to affect Dolby TrueHD Atmos ones?

Thanks for all the help

Are discs available which do not include 7.1 the for ATMOS or are we saying the BPD-83 is obsolete for future releases. It almost sounds like dolby atmos is not compliant with the previous versions. If that is the case I will no longer be buying atmos encoded discs.

I'm sure Oppo answered you if you sent an email or web contact. It probably wound up in your spam filter.

Anyhow, no its not "all" TrueHD, only 7.1 where complex seamless branching is used. TrueHD is exceptionally demanding on processors, 7.1 more so than 5.1. There should be no issues at all with 7.1 DTS even where seamless branching is used, but its not impossible if they go crazy with the protection.

Complex seamless branching protection is used in combination with playlist obfuscation, by means of the JAVA code that's on the disc. If the JAVA code smells a disc copy it picks the wrong playlist and you get a scrambled movie and/or copy protection warnings. Most of these type movies use dozens of smaller video files to stitch together the movie from - instead of one large video file like any sane movie mastering would use.

We've yet to see an Atmos release that does not include 7.1 audio, so it may be safe to assume that 7.1 is required to correctly encode the Atmos "object based" audio. These disc do also include a compatibility audio track you can select rather than the 7.1 Atmos track.

The good news is that Atmos audio mastering, (and Dolby TrueHD in general), is exceptionally expensive to master, difficult to decode, and generally a PITA for movie studios, so don't expect movie studios to jump into releasing Atmos encoded films in large numbers. Right now, Dolby is sweetening the pot for them to use it but that won't last forever. The other upcoming "3D" audio flavors, Auro and DTS, actually stand a better chance of widespread adoption due to lower licensing fees and production costs.

Also good to note that most of the current crop of Pre/Pro and AVRs also offer their own proprietary "3D' audio DSP which by some accounts actually work better.

My expectation or fear is that the studios will jump on the ATMOS bandwagon like they did for 3D and start encoding every disc with the new format which essentially would make my OPPO BDP-83 obsolete for newer discs. I would fully expect that DTS-X will also do the same thing. I don't buy many discs and where I live streaming is out of the question (no bandwidth) so I use NetFlix to watch new releases. If all the discs become contaminated with ATMOS and DTS-X I will have to buy a new player.

Been away from the Outlaws for some time. Need help.

Problem: I purchased a new Oppo BDP-105d. When I set the digital output on the Oppo to bitstream I get audio dropouts,loud pops and distortion when watching VUDU or NETFLIX. I have exchanged 3 105 players and all 3 did the same thing.
Oppo told me it was because the 990 was old and did not process the new Dolby Digital Plus. I was instructed to set the Oppo 105 digital output to LPCM192 which I did and it corrected the problem. The problem now is the sound quality is greatly reduced. Using the 990 I get better envelopment of the surround channels with a greater feeling of spaciousness to the sound. I use the Outlaw 990 7.1 outputs to Oppo 7.1 input for blue ray movies and high resolution sacd audio but normal 5.1 on VUDU and NTFLIX sounds better with Outlaws own DACS. If I reinstall my old player the problem goes completely away.
Is there any type of work around I can do to correct this or am I stuck.

Setting the Oppo to output PCM has nothing to do with DAC, that conversion is done in the decoder. I assume you use SPDIF to the Outlaw for this. Most likely the difference you hear is simply the result of different levels that result from PCM vs bitstream input.

The cabling could get a bit cluttered but why not run the BDP-105D as a stand alone device? It is fully capable of operating as its own pre/pro.

When the OPPO is set to LPCM it is doing the decoding of the audio tracks on the disc and sending it to the 990 which understands LPCM and does some bass management functions and sends that to the amp. If VUDU or NetFlix are coming to the 990 as bitstream you are depending on the 990 to do the decoding which it can do for all the older formats of DTS and Dolby. If the source material from streaming is set up for the newer formats the 990 may have some issues trying to decode them. Setting your OPPO to LPCM bypasses the decoding issues of the 990 and cures the problem. It also makes use of the highest quality DACs in your system. Those DACs are what make the OPPO 105D so expensive so you might as well use them. The best pathway is as described above to use the analog outputs from the OPPO to the 990 analog inputs and let the OPPOO do all decoding.

I also own a Oppo BDP-95. When I connect the (S/PDIF)coax output from the 95 to the Outlaw 990 coax digital input I do not experience the same dropout issues. Why doesn't the 95 experience the dropouts using the same output setting?
This also doesn't explain the difference in gain between the S/PDIF and the LPCm192. I understand the better DACS are in the Oppo but their is more to sound then just DACS. Many things effect sound. But why does the S/PDIF output of the 105 not work on the Outlaw to begin with. What changes were assigned to the "NEW" Dolby Digital Plus that make it better? Also when using the S/PDIF coax output the sound has better dynamics and a more engaging sound field with more surround information then when using the LPCM192. I bought the Oppo 105 for better video quality and flexibility over the 95.I did not expect to throw away the 990 DACS to when viewing NETFIX and VUDU. When I watch DIRECTV I do not have these dropout compatibility issues. Why are they issues with NETFLIX and VUDU to begin with. Using the 95 allowed me to pick either Sabre DACS or Analog Devices on Outlaw. I liked that.

Outputs: 4 volts Oppo 105 vs 9 volts output Outlaw 990. This explains the gain difference as well as the added head room. This also explains why many feel you need a preamp in front of the 105. In theory 2 volt output can drive most amplifiers to full output. In reality this seldom works you lose base impact and dynamic range. To test this theory I put a 4 channel class A active crossover between the BDP-105 7.1 output(I use 5.1)and the 7.1 input (again I use 5.1 only)of the Outlaw input. (The active crossover will swing 14 volts). The surrounds are set to small in Outlaw. The activate crossover does 3 fronts and sub. In this setup when I use 7.1 with LPCM192 the dynamics are restored and using the 105 as a preamp would work. It still will not fix the bitstream issue to the 990 but the gain and dynamics are back.
I got this idea from theta digital. All of their stand alone D/A

Sorry about that I messed up the last part:
Here is the entire statement:
Outputs: Oppo 105 4 volts vs 9 volts output Outlaw 990. This explains the gain difference as well as the added head room. This also explains why many feel you need a preamp in front of the 105. In theory 2 volt output can drive most amplifiers to full output. In reality this seldom works you lose base impact and dynamic range. To test this theory I put a 4 channel class A active crossover between the BDP-105 7.1 output(I use 5.1)and the 7.1 input (again I use 5.1 only)of the Outlaw input. (The active crossover will swing 14 volts). The surrounds are set to small in Outlaw. The activate crossover does 3 fronts and sub. In this setup when I use 7.1 with LPCM192 and play NETFLIX or VUDU the dynamics are restored and using the 105 as a preamp would work. It still will not fix the bitstream issue to the 990 but the gain and dynamics are back.
I got this idea from theta digital. All of their stand alone D/A converters swing massive output volts. THETA Digital explained years ago how this enhanced dynamics and headroom. I tried it. Whatever the reason it works.
I know audio advances I just don't see what the Dolby Digital Plus brings to Netflix. I would not classify their picture quality and sound as high end. I'm using 40 mps speed. Its ok but certainly not great.
What do you guys think?

Amazon is using it too. What it brings is better compression.

I think you may be some sort of mad scientist. Can't comment on the streaming aspect as that is something I am unable to do at the moment. The problem we will all run into eventually is the there isn't enough available bandwidth to support HD video and audio.