Before or after Pre/Pro

I wonder where is the best place to put it - BEFORE Pre/Pro or between Pre/Pro and Amp, disabling somehow your Pre/Pro bass management functions.
It looks like Outlaw suggest the first, but it is not clear why (attenuation?).

I think it depends on what you are trying to achieve. If you are looking for bass management for a DVD-Audio or SACD player only, you'd want to put it between the player and the pre/pro. In that case, the pre/pro's bass management would still be used for all other sources (DVD video player, CD player, LaserDisc player, etc...). It is also possible, however, to put it between the pre/pro and the amp and disable the pre/pro's bass management (if the pre/pro's bass management for stuff like digital inputs is disappointing). I think Outlaw suggests the first (before the pre/pro) more than the second in their manual, but that's likely because the ICBM was conceived to provide bass management for DVD-Audio and SACD players rather than as a bass management add-on to a pre/pro.

I was wondering the same thing. I will want to control bass on DVD-A but if the bass management is so good what is the downside to setting my preamp to large speakers all around and letting the ICBM do all the bass routing? I don't have any gripes with my preamp's bass management. Would it be easier to separate the bass management duties for everything else?

I think someone mentioned in one of the other fora (was it Charlie?) that you could potentially get time alignment problems with this sort of setup, as bass really needs to be extracted before the time alignment is performed.

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Matthew J. Hill
matt@idsi.net

Nah - not me ;-) (really!)

But it's true. The niftiest solution so far IMO was the guy (RAF?) that told the pre/pro to send all bass to front and then stuck the ICBM before the amp on the front channels, kind of a special purpose active crossover.

Hopefully the next pre/pro will get better bass management.

Charlie

Yeah, I did a search and couldn't find the post. But I'm still confused. In a 5.1 system with dvd-a, and/or sacd plus satellite, vcr, etc. is it best to go one way or the other, easier to adjust one way or the other, or does no one know for sure. Assume all small mains, center, and surrounds with a decent sub.
As an aside, is there an option to buy the inconnects as a package deal with 12 instead of six. It seems jto me you'll need connectors going to and from the icbm. Why do they only list 6 interconnects as an option?
G.

This is a situation where an ICBM with built-in switching (mentioned in earlier threads) would be a definite plus. Alternatively, a switch box before the ICBM would do, but that involves 24(!) interconnects...

As an additional request... one of the switch boxes out there has a built-in remote trigger. The guy wants $200 for it, which I'm sure some people will pay. Integrating that into the ICBM would add a lot of value to it, and I doubt they'd have to charge an additional $200 to break even. If the 950 or its successor had a programmable trigger it would make a great integration. Even better, the 950 would have an additional "input" that would select the 5.1 input and send voltage on the trigger, allowing complete integration. That way you wouldn't have to use up two unused inputs, as the guy suggests on his web page.

As to 12 interconnects... yeah, there is a discount. You get twice the discount as buying 6 interconnects.

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Matthew J. Hill
matt@idsi.net

Yikes! 24 more interconnects plus another switchbox? I think I'll go the other way and just use it for the bass on dvd-a/sacd. Thanks for your help Matthew.

I wish I had your knowledge of earlier threads.

Gary
(soon to be ordering icbm plus 12 interconnects)

Assuming the specified setup - all small with a sub - you could tell the pre/pro that you have large fronts, then insert the ICBM between the fronts and LFE. Let the ICBM shave the bass from the fronts, redirect to the sub.

Total additional components - 3 cables.

Left, LFE, Right pass through the ICBM. Just be sure the delay is the same for LFE and fronts. As a bonus you can have stereo subs later.

Charlie

Charlie,



Yes, that is definately a workable solution, as I use it today with a Marchand XM9-L electronic stereo xover. Benefits of the XM9 are level controls for both high-pass and low pass, level control at the exact xover frequency, a bass sum switch (L+R) and 24dB Linkwitz-Riley xovers for both high-pass and low-pass. You customize the xover frequency with replaceable plug-in resistor packs.

This allows for bass control from all source components.

Wish the ICBM had symmetrical 24dB L-R filter choices.

bstan

[This message has been edited by bstan (edited March 12, 2002).]

[This message has been edited by bstan (edited March 12, 2002).]

[This message has been edited by bstan (edited March 12, 2002).]

FWIW I use an ICBM between my DVD-A player and MC-12. I use it solely for DVD-A bass management as I use the MC-12 in bypass mode for DVD-A.

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Nigel Pond
SMR Home Theatre
SMR Forums
SMR Group
HighFidelityReview

Yup. That's how I'm gonna use my ICBM too. Before my OA 950 for SACD only.

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Take Care,
merc

I have been using my ICBM for a couple months now for both SACD and DVD-A. I have been using two cheap radio shack switches to switch between the two formats. Then I use the output of the switches to my ICBM. Then the output of the ICBM to the 5.1 input on a Denon receiver which I am using as a pre/pro.(hope to replace with 950 soon)

I just purchased but yet receive a Sony TA-P9000ES analog preamp to replace the radio shack switches. This preamp has two sets of 5.1 inputs and a bypass set of 5.1 inputs for your present pre/pro. I will now be moving the ICBM to between my amp and preamp and setting all speakers to large on the Denon.

I am wondering what issues I will have with time alignment on sources from the Denon. Would it be to my advantage to get another ICBM so I have one for each audio format? I want the best sound I can get from both SACD and DVD-A but I don't want to degrade the sound quality with digital audio sources from the Denon.