What to do about a subwoofer???

Hey Folks,

I'm new here and just bought my RR 2150. So far so good...I love it! But I have a few questions for anyone who might know a little more about these kind of things.

I'm running a vintage pair 1967-68 Sansui SP-100's along with a Techincs SL1200 MK5 turntable through the RR 2150. I want to add a powered sub (I think...do I even need it with these speakers?) and didn't know what kind to get because I'm confused on how to run it to the amp and let the RR2150 use its bass management system to run the sub (rather than using the powered sub's amp). The Outlaw folks suggest using their management system rather than the one on most subs...so...does the sub I looking for need to have a "Bypass" option in order for this to work? Or does the LFE option take care of this? Basically I want to know how I can use the RR 2150's management system with a powered sub and what features the sub must have for this to work.

On a side note...anyone know if the SP-100s are good speakers? I cant seem to find specs on them (probably because I'm the only one on the planet still using them). Should I look at getting a whole new speaker setup? I love these old speakers...they work just fine to my ears and are in almost perfect condition, but would new speakers be better suited for the RR2150? These were sent from the Philippines while my dad was in Vietnam. I've used them for years and have a hard time letting them go...When I play original LPs from the 60's I feel like the combo of the vinyl and speakers from the time period warp me back to how it would have sounded back then...for some reason a "historical sound" is of value to me...hahaha!

Any help here would be great! Thanks guys!

Doug

Douggie_Fresh,

I remember those speakers and I am betting that they were purchased in a military PX. If I remember they probably have a latticed wood grill.

These speakers are efficient and will play reasonably loud with a few watts. They had a reputation for a very pleasing midrange. They were a big favorite during the Vietnam era.

However they have limited dynamic range and real power handling ability compared to today's offerings. Using bass management and a sub is compulsory because they could easily be damaged.

In my opinion, it might be time to consider upgrading to new speakers since the demands of newer recordings (or remastered oldies which you love) could exceed the limits of this model.

Peter

Found these specs for them:
Scheme 3 ways, 3 speaker bass-reflex scheme, and a bookshelf type
Unit
For low-pass: 25cm cone type
For mid ranges: 12cm cone type
For high regions: 5cm horn type
Frequency characteristic 45Hz - 20000Hz
The maximum input 25W
Impedance 8ohms
Output sound pressure level 100dB/W
Cross over frequency 1500Hz, 5000Hz (12 dB/oct)
Dimensions Width 358x height 620x depth of 300mm
Weight 15.7kg


As you can see the maximum input is 25 watts and the rated SPL at 1 watt is 100. They will work great with the 2150 but I agree they need a sub for best performance and so you don't have to push them too hard. I would also suggest putting a half amp fuse in line with the positive speaker wire when you connect it to the amp. That way, a transient on the system doesn't damage your vintage speakers for which I am sure there are no parts available. You can go smaller than that but you might have to change the fuses occasionally when they blow.

As far as the sub, get a good powered sub and connect it to the 2150s sub out. If the sub does not have a bypass mode you just have to set the low pass filter setting all the way up and let the 2150 do the bass management. You won't believe the change in how the system sounds even with a cheap subwoofer. My first sub was a KLH 8 inch with 100W of power and it made a huge difference because the mains no longer had to work so hard at the low end. I would cross you mains over above 100 HZ and see how it sounds and then you can dial it in to your tastes.

I thank both of you very much for your responses...Yes...the grill on the outside of the speakers are as you describe! ...and thanks also for the specs....I couldn't find them.

So if I understand what you are saying...I don't really need the bypass option as long as I can adjust the high/low on the sub. I don't know why I had it stuck in my head that I needed the bypass...maybe I read that somewhere and misunderstood.

Do either of you have any suggestions for a sub in the $200 to $250 range that would work well?

Thanks again!

Douggie_Fresh,

Are you wire tapping our office? Stand by for an announcement.......

yes...my spies are everywhere...hahaha! JK

Don't leave me hangin...what-chu got? : D

Maybe this is a stupid question....do you guys work for Outlaw? I'm just trying to figure out whos office I need to tap...haha!

XenonMan,

I'm going to sound like a novice for sure on this...how would I go about adding the fuse to the speaker wire? And I"m guessing I would need two...one for each of the Sansui's? I looked at the fuses online...but how do you connect them to the positive wire? I've never had to do this before...but maybe I should be?

thanks again

Douggie_Fresh,

Peter T (Tribeman) is Outlaw's President! You got the Outlaw gang leader on your first try. And you even managed to get a little Outlaw intelligence out of him--which a lot of other Outlaws continue to try to do mostly to no avail! Therefore, you might want to be on the look out for an impending announcement of new Outlaw sub in the $200 to $250 price range.

Good to know...I thought he was just someone like me who had bought one of the RR 2150s...good to know I'm talking with the top...hahaha! Hopefully we will soon find out!

Go to Radioshack and ask them for an inline fuse holder. Get an assortment of smaller fuses like .25, .5 fast and sloblo types. They will know what I mean. The sloblo fuses will allow transient power peaks and will still provide plenty of protection. I use them all the time in my Advents because they don't make parts anymore and I love the way they sound. The fuse is about an inch long and as big around as a crayon. The fuse holder is designed to hold the fuse and make good contact. The holder is wired so that one end is connected bare wire directly to your speakers positive terminal. The other end is connected to the speaker wire coming from the amplifier. You only need one per speaker and it should be on the positive side to prevent damage. You can connect the holders to your speaker wire any way you feel comfortable. I use a plastic wire nut. If you crank up your amp too high the fuse will blow and prevent damage. You can experiment with the proper size so you don't have to change them so often. The fuse holder is held together by a bayonet type connector so all you have to do is twist it to remove and install the fuse. Once you see it, it will be very obvious how to connect and use it. The fuse holder shouldn't cost more than $5 or so.

On the sub side of things, I bought a $100 KLH sub 15 years ago that is still pounding out the bass. While it doesn't go as low as most it still does pretty well in my 3.1 system.

Check out the KLH ASW100 or this Polk on Amazon with free shipping or wait for Scotts announcement.

Polk Audio PSW10 10-Inch Monitor Series Powered Subwoofer

Hey thanks, for the info, XenonMan...I think I'll go check out Radioshack and see what I can find...sounds simple enough and I want to make sure these speakers don't die. Honestly I'm surprised they have made it this long...as a teenager I was pretty rough on them.

Down the line I'm going to add a set of speakers...that way I don't have to use these all the time, and can see how both work with the 2150. Yeah...I'm thinking I don't need too much in a sub...something in the 8" range...maybe 10"...I just want to have the option to use either the sub or the 2150s management system.

Douggie_Fresh,

If you wait until Monday, your patience will be rewarded. We've been working on this one for six months. We have quietly been field testing it in a number of venues and we now know it is something very special.

Peter

Sounds good... I'll see what comes about on Monday...thanks for the heads up, PeterT.