Interesting, do you find the lack of sound quality using a cheap dock bothersome? I would guess that most folks here who spend a decent amount of money on a system would want the best possible music quality? -Bob

I want access to the 12000 songs I have on my iPod. I don't like wearing headphones all the time and I do think I get pretty good playback quality. I am somewhat older and my ears are not what they used to be but.... I think my iPod going through my systems sounds just fine. I don't find the sound quality to be bad. I am also pretty sure that CDs sound better than Vinyl and that the limits of human hearing ends around 25 khz no matter what a lot of people want to spend money on. I adhere to the old axiom that the louder something is the better it sounds to most people. Therefore you just have to crank it up loud enough to make it sound good.

I am with you XenonMan. My hearing is not what it use to be back in the days of Rock and Roll at The Electric Factory here in Philadelphia. I recently purchased (1year) a chordette dac and use the bypass mode on my 990 and using my iPhone (bluetooth) I think my music sounds very good if not fantastic.
Granted put all of your sound meters, graphs and what have you the sonics reading b/c I am using bluetooth will not get as good a reading as from another from of playback but considering that I am streaming music I feel it sounds damn good.
I still at times use my Oppo 93 to listen to SACD's and also two channel.
Sometimes I have compared sound quality using my Oppo and streaming my iPhone using the same recording and I can be pretty critical but I did not notice that much difference.
Of course a younger pair of ears might notice even the slightest flaw in my music but I do not think to the point of dislike.

I currently stream FLAC audio to my AVR and occasionally use high bitrate MP3 (320kbit). Haven't found anyone who can tell the difference between either of those and the actual CD playing and the digital bitstream hitting the AVR over HDMI. I only keep the DVD/BluRay player around for those (rare) times when someone brings a movie or music that I don't already have on my media server. I could never go back to using coasters again.

For movies, I just rip everything into an MKV container and use H.264 at a high bitrate (I leave the audio track alone). At 1080p resolution on my 42" display, I can't see any visible difference between that and a BluRay title playing from the BluRay transport.

Best,

First thing

I agree with Xenonman and Rubbersoul in that my hearing ain't what she used to be. I think when I went to an AC DC concert 20 years ago my hearing went right there and then. I actually still hear fine BUT things are not 100 %. I cannot hear anything above 16khz.

Second thing

I love my bluray player but a server IS the way to go as Ritz just posted above. FLAC is every bit as good as CD. I have spoken to an experienced emplyoee at a hi-end audio store in my area and he said that Bluray is dead as far as a the future is concerned. He would NOT want to sell me one at a high price even though he carries a few high end models at over $1000. He says that media servers, like Kalaidescape which they sell, are the future. Although Kalaidescape is very expensive and out of the reach of many people (one being me), he says that there is where the industry is headed because that is what the masses want.

This is where Outlaw should be concentrating. They obviously are putting a lot of work in the 978 and their R&D should then be focused on an affordable server in the near or mid future.

I guess it is always driven by "what the masses want". I am 52, and work part time in the music industry so I am at at lot of music events such as SXSW and ACL Festival not to mention nearly 40 years of concert going. I'm not going to claim a golden ear, but I can and do detect a distinct difference in most compressed digital formats vs discs or "coasters" as they referred to by some. If the masses are more concerned with quantity over quality, as it is with so many aspects of our lives (American diet for instance) then it is a very sad day. I remember so fondly buying a new album and pouring over the liner notes and artwork as I listened to the music. My eyes are not good enough to do so with a CD, but at least I have something to hold in my hand. I am NOT thrilled about streaming entertainment data and will be the very last to adopt if forced to. I think of Pink Floyd's "Sheep" when I read stuff like this. Technology is not always going in the right direction folks. Gadgets and features are really nothing more than toys. The audio industry is stuck in this "me too" game trying to outdo or keep up with the other guy and make the "feature creatures" happy. That sucks for us and is a part of why our 978 is so delayed. Really, who need to control their equipment from a friggin' IPhone?

I imagine there will always be media on disc for die hard audiophiles just as vinyl has gained a rebirth for that same audience. At least I hope so.

BTW, please excuse the ranting. I should have had my coffee first.

AusTexRocker

Ranting totally excused. Just so everybody knows where I actually stand, I agree with AusTexRocker. I would love to see Bluray continue gloriously into the future AND improved down the road. Unfortunately streaming and downloading is where the industry is going and NOBODY who is part of the masses and just goes with the flow is a member of this forum. This is why we are all here. We care for the best and also for improvement on "the best."

I myself am not far behind from AusTexRocker in age. I am 47 and have a family and I STILL do not own an IPod. I am planning to get one soon for my car since it is IPod ready and I am too lazy in my middle age to keep hauling down the CD collection and loading the car system up with it.

What I believe, if not mistaken, Ritz was speaking about excellent recorded FLAC audio. Much of the material may not be available at such high quality recordings. I don't believe that a well recorded IPod song on high end systems like ours in the forum will sound quite as good as a well pressed CD. I don't think a well pressed CD is important in a car. For me my car's (2008 Acura TL with NAV) system sounds good but all said a car is a car is a car. It is not a nice home system and cannot be.

Yes...Who wants to control their system from a friggin' Iphone.
At least I had my coffee.

It's kinda pointless to play Don Quixote against the formats that the music industry insists on peddling. *shrug*

I'm also in my 40's and a former music industry exec with a lot of time in the studios (on the recording end). I used to think I could tell the difference between a CD and a 320kbit mp3. Then someone challenged me to an blind A/B session and guess what....I couldn't. As far as FLAC goes, you definitely can't tell any difference because it's the same (lossless) bitstream that you'd get from the source. I purchase all my music on CD/DVD/BluRay and then rip it. I don't buy compressed music of any type unless it's something I don't want to waste money buying a whole disc for...we've all got those one hit wonders we like, after all. After it's ripped, the original goes in a box and likely never gets seen again unless I decide I want to look at the vanishingly small liner notes. I do that for convenience and to prevent the original coasters from being scratched by the kids (or adults after a few too many). You can't beat the convenience. Scroll through your list of titles, search based on whatever criteria you want, set it up to randomly play, etc....all on your TV screen. If you have a party, nobody needs to go anywhere near your expensive gear and can flip through your content at a safe distance without so much as a peep from me on how to navigate around. It's THAT easy.

For $100 you can get a dock that outputs digital from an Ipod. For less than $200 you can put in a 240 GB hard drive. By doing that, I now have a 2/3rds full Ipod, all lossless, of 7000 songs, sending a digital signal into an external DAC.

Sounds atleast as good as the Oppo doing the same thing...

I hate Apple, but the Ipod is my one thing I deal with from them...

I am in your camp Ritz2 with one exception. I have ripped all of my CDs using Apple's lossless compression. I have found that all of my music (in lossless form) fits quite nicely on an 80GB ipod classic.