Given the changes that have occurred again in the feature set of the final product(978), one important question I didn't see the answer to here is:

HOW MUCH?

I think to answer the cost to us question might be just a bit premature. If you were following the Audyssey bit, then one might think that the official deal is in the works and as such, licensing costs and estimations on the effort to integrate it into the product would affect the price of the unit. But I think within 4 weeks we might have a number.

Just getting caught up on the developments. This is awesome news.

Here's to hoping there isn't some political b.s. in the works with Audyssey.

HIP HIP.... HORAAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You would think that since Trinnov is out and Audyssey is in and the rest is pretty much the same as the 998 was expected to be, the price should be right around the $1399. All of the delays and lack of updates make the purchase of the Onkyo PR-SC886 from Outlaw last year look like a great decision. Especially since I don't care about 3D.

I'm sorry but how is this different from the current bunch of avr on the market now? So is this a replacement for the 970? I'm happy to see outlaw move forward with a new pre/pro, but I'v waited for the flaship pre/pro with room correction second to none. Is Trinnov superior to Audyssey? Will Audyssey accept being good enough for 978, but not good enough for the flagship 998?. I'm just not sure how good this news is? If the audio performance is superior to the 990 I guess i'm in. I just want a great pre/pro that sounds as good as the 990. I guess Outlaw has spoiled me.

As with any other pre/pro, the difference is largely going to be one of priorities: the pre/pro (especially when produced by a smaller company with less expansive R&D resources) sacrifices some bells and whistles like network connectivity while placing greater emphasis on performance (things like the DAC's that Peter mentioned).


Price-wise, it's not clear yet, but I suspect the Model 978 is closer to being a successor to the Model 990. The balanced outputs certainly fit that notion, at least. It sounds like the Model 998 will be almost a peer to the Model 978 except for Trinnov - although I wouldn't be surprised if they decided tuck in another tweak or two on the Model 998 before it was all said and done.


In theory, Trinnov's 3D remapping has the potential to really distance it from Audyssey, but getting it right appears to be tricky (to put it mildly) so we haven't yet seen a really definitive implementation of it in a consumer-level product. Audyssey has dominated for years now, though, and one reason for that dominance is simple: it's a pretty effective tool for what it is. There are also a number of different degrees of sophistication to Audyssey that have to be factored in, as well. At it's most basic, Audyssey is a quite good automatic setup tool with a pretty decent room correction aspect. As you step up the levels, the room correction gets more sophisticated and can do more to help compensate for undesirable room conditions.


I liked my Model 990, and I like the sounds of what has been described for the Model 978. I think their goal is to match (or exceed) the Model 990's sound quality in conjunction with the new features. From a model number perspective, I could see someone describing the Model 978 as a "Model 993" - following along the same lineage as the Model 990, but with Audyssey as a more expedient alternative to the Model 998's Trinnov.

I think difficulties with implementing Trinnov at less than stratospheric pricing is the major hurdle to the 998. I was looking forward to Trinnov implementation more than 3D capable HDMI. I imagine that a direct comparison between the 990 and the 978 in my audio environment will be needed before I could say the spending is justified. While I doubt it, I’m keeping an open ear. But this comes from someone already ‘sold’ on Outlaw.

When thinking about pre/pro customers new to Outlaw, virtually none would say, “What, it doesn’t have Trinnov?” On the other hand, many contemplating a move away from the big-box mass-market would be put off if 3D were not included.

In an earlier post I did say I was ‘sold’ on 3D, and, in theory, I still am. But, in my view, 3D needs several things to be seen in a highly effective way versus just ‘the next thing’ in a sales-marketing scenario that is always looking for something new to sell. Ads that show birds, butterflies and other items flying out into the room are misleading in that the 3D effect is only seen in the rectangular cone between each viewer’s eyes and the borders of the display being viewed, just as 2D objects are not seen beyond these borders. Any ad showing objects being viewed outside of the borders is, in effect, false advertising. Anyone want to join a class action suit? Anyway, I think that unless a 3D scene can fill either half or more of a viewer’s field of vision, or the great majority of the viewer’s conscious visual attention area, 3D within a ‘boxed tunnel’ is only a borderline gimmick.

Because a 3D signal can go from player to display without involving the pre/pro, I don’t see 3D capable HDMI in a pre/pro as an enticement for me. I chose to run different HDMI sources directly to my display, rather than switching beforehand, because my display allows for custom settings associated with each input. If all my sources are switched before the display, the display would need another way to determine what source originated the signal arriving at the one input I was using on the display.

So, while I think the 978 may be good for Outlaw, and think that’s a good thing overall, the waning of my personal enthusiasm for the 978 due to the lack of Trinnov is not turned around by the presence of 3D HDMI. If the 978 makes it into my system to stay, it will have to be on the merits of audio performance strikingly better than the 990.

3D will not be the deciding factor in why I look for the 978/998 platform. I do not believe 3D is here to stay, despite all the marketing hype. Unless they come up with a way to make it work without glasses I am sceptical as to whether it will ever be mainstream. I would rather look to a platform that could support resolution beyond 1080P with superb sound. The best 3D movie I have ever seen is Avatar but it looks just as good in 2D BluRay. If a screen the size of a movie theaters' can't implement it without glasses, I can't ever see it coming to my livingroom.

True. I would add that it may be faster to work out 3D than Trinnov if you choose to tackle just one of them.


True that you can bypass the processor with 3D, but it takes some care. For Blu-ray, for example, you need a player with dual HDMI outputs.

All I want to know at this point is when will the preorder link show up on their website because I'm in!!!!!! `