#84858 - 10/10/10 02:30 PM
Re: Ready by Christmas?
[Re: gonk]
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Gunslinger
Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 131
Loc: Winnipeg, MB, Canada
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You'd probably need to use either 720p or 1080p (assuming the plasma accepts a 1080p signal). For standard definition viewed on 768p panels, the best option may well be to send 480p to the display, taking advantage of the excellent deinterlacing capability of the ABT chip, but thereby ensuring that the image is only scaled once. I've never understood why it's often recommended to send 720p signals to a 768p panel (as it's "closest" to the native resolution) since that necessitates 2 scaling operations (480p to 720p in the source device or AVR/processor, then 720p to 768p in the display). Each scaling operation can only degrade rather than improve the image. Of course, that assumes that the panel has a good scaler, but many do. It's certainly worth trying 480p.
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#84859 - 10/10/10 03:18 PM
Re: Ready by Christmas?
[Re: GaryB]
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Desperado
Registered: 01/01/03
Posts: 506
Loc: Torrance, CA USA
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Wonder how the 978 will compare to the Marantz AV7005? I was very tempted by the open box sale of the SR7005, but will hold off for now.
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Living Room 24x18 open 1/2 flight up to a raised dining room/hall 24x12 Outlaw 976 pre-pro running 5.1 system Outlaw 750 for Artison Masterpiece LCR and 2 NHT SuperZeros rears Velodyne Servo FX-1200 LG OLED65C8PUA via HDMI2 to/from 976 HDMI ARC Roku Ultra Samsung BD-D5500 BluRay Amazon FireStick 4K to 976 Aux HDMI input for Amazon Music Ultra
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#84861 - 10/10/10 03:33 PM
Re: Ready by Christmas?
[Re: casey01]
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Gunslinger
Registered: 07/12/02
Posts: 41
Loc: On an island
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Since the original announcement of the 997 then the 998 now the 978, when it comes to the mainstream companies and their ongoing product offerings, there has been a considerable sum of water that has passed under the bridge. Honestly speaking, the 978 will have to be quite impressive, virtually trouble free and offered at a very competitive price before I would consider it. There is just too many attractive options out there in the marketplace and for my self with TWO 7125s and some pretty sophisticated outboard video processing, the Marantz 5005 being offered on this very website used as a pre-pro would be more than adequate for my needs.
Hmm, let's see, 5005(which is available now) or the 978(possibly available at some point in the future and not knowing the features or the price). The clock is ticking. At least in existing models, Marantz' processor is not powerful enough to do Audyssey room correction on TrueHD or STS-HD MA at, I believe, 24-bit/96KHz sampling. So it dropped Audyssey. Lame. And that fact was never on their website; one needed to dig deep into the manual to find it. And even then, the wording was weaselly. Personally, I would never consider buying a Marantz. Jeff
Edited by pepar (10/10/10 03:35 PM)
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"Veni, vidi, vino." ("I came, I saw, I drank wine.")
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#84862 - 10/10/10 05:37 PM
Re: Ready by Christmas?
[Re: GaryB]
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Desperado
Registered: 03/21/01
Posts: 14054
Loc: Memphis, TN USA
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At least in existing models, Marantz' processor is not powerful enough to do Audyssey room correction on TrueHD or STS-HD MA at, I believe, 24-bit/96KHz sampling.
So it dropped Audyssey. Lame. And that fact was never on their website; one needed to dig deep into the manual to find it. And even then, the wording was weaselly. Personally, I would never consider buying a Marantz. The SR5005 changed that, from what I've heard. Outlaw's SR5005 guide even made a point of mentioning the change. That means the other x005's probably have the same change. For standard definition viewed on 768p panels, the best option may well be to send 480p to the display, taking advantage of the excellent deinterlacing capability of the ABT chip, but thereby ensuring that the image is only scaled once. I've never understood why it's often recommended to send 720p signals to a 768p panel (as it's "closest" to the native resolution) since that necessitates 2 scaling operations (480p to 720p in the source device or AVR/processor, then 720p to 768p in the display). Each scaling operation can only degrade rather than improve the image.
Of course, that assumes that the panel has a good scaler, but many do. It's certainly worth trying 480p. Good point. For SD, the best bet is to experiment - I'd try 480p, 720p, and (if supported) 1080p to decide which yielded the best picture quality. Which one works best will depend on a bunch of factors.
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#84868 - 10/10/10 11:48 PM
Re: Ready by Christmas?
[Re: gonk]
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Desperado
Registered: 09/12/05
Posts: 619
Loc: El Cajon, California
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The ABT2010 is a chip I've spent some time with and been quite happy with when used in conjunction with DVD's, but it does depend on the firmware implementation as well. The most likely Anchor Bay chip will be the ABT2015, which is similar to the ABT2010, so it should offer similar potential.
If your plasma is a "non-standard" resolution (the various flavors of 768p), my understanding is that it is prohibitively complex for the panel's native resolution to be supported (too many variations in timing and specific resolution). Some standalone video processors support it, but it's really hard to do - OPPO tried it with the BDP-83 during beta testing and concluded that there were too many problems. You'd probably need to use either 720p or 1080p (assuming the plasma accepts a 1080p signal). Ah, my Pioneer 5080 is a 768p but does accept a 1080p signal. That is how I have it set up with the oppo BDP-83. So does the 83 have either of the chips you mentioned? I'm very pleased with the DVD performance from the oppo and if the 978 can do the same with standard def TV it would be great.
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AvFan Outlaw 976 | ATI 2005 | M&K 850s Left, Center & Right, Surround-55s, MX-70B Sub | Harmony 950 remote | Panamax 5100 | OPPO UDP-203 | LG OLED55B7
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#84869 - 10/11/10 01:30 AM
Re: Ready by Christmas?
[Re: AvFan]
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Gunslinger
Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 131
Loc: Winnipeg, MB, Canada
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So does the 83 have either of the chips you mentioned? Yes, the BDP-83 uses the ABT2010 chip as you can see in this image from OPPO's website. If you feel inclined, try sending DVDs at 480p instead of 1080p from the 83 to your Kuro and see if you notice any change in image quality (I realize the 5080 is doing just fine with 1080p). I'm very curious.
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#84870 - 10/11/10 07:21 AM
Re: Ready by Christmas?
[Re: AvFan]
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Desperado
Registered: 03/21/01
Posts: 14054
Loc: Memphis, TN USA
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Ah, my Pioneer 5080 is a 768p but does accept a 1080p signal. That is how I have it set up with the oppo BDP-83. So does the 83 have either of the chips you mentioned? I'm very pleased with the DVD performance from the oppo and if the 978 can do the same with standard def TV it would be great. OPPO Digital started working with the ABT2010 with the DV-983H (originally built with two separate chips - the ABT102 for deinterlacing and the ABT1018 for scaling - although later production runs went with the ABT2010 in place of them) and re-used that experience when they developed the BDP-83, which includes the ABT2010. The ABT2015 was released last year as a somewhat less expensive alternative to the ABT2010 and has started showing up in a number of receivers this year.
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#84871 - 10/11/10 07:22 AM
Re: Ready by Christmas?
[Re: GaryB]
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Desperado
Registered: 03/21/01
Posts: 14054
Loc: Memphis, TN USA
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Yes, the BDP-83 uses the ABT2010 chip as you can see in this image from OPPO's website. If you feel inclined, try sending DVDs at 480p instead of 1080p from the 83 to your Kuro and see if you notice any change in image quality (I realize the 5080 is doing just fine with 1080p). I'm very curious. One drawback to setting the player to 480p is that it'll scale BD's down to 480p as well. It would be an interesting experiment, but might not be a good long-term solution.
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#84872 - 10/11/10 07:59 AM
Re: Ready by Christmas?
[Re: gonk]
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Desperado
Registered: 09/12/05
Posts: 619
Loc: El Cajon, California
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It is encouraging that Outlaw is using ABT given my experience with ABT employed in my oppo. We will have to wait and see which chip they will use in the 978. Thanks for the info on the chip development.
I compared 1080p to 720p when I set up my oppo and couldn't really see any difference but I never used 480p. I'll check it out if I get a chance and report back. I suspect the scaling capability of my Pioneer is pretty good since I couldn't see any difference between 720p or 1080p from the oppo to 768p. I suspect I won't see any difference going between 480p and 768p but I'll check.
Edit: Gonk's note about BD at 480p is why I used 1080p. I only compared 720p and 1080p on DVD playback.
Edited by AvFan (10/11/10 08:01 AM)
_________________________
AvFan Outlaw 976 | ATI 2005 | M&K 850s Left, Center & Right, Surround-55s, MX-70B Sub | Harmony 950 remote | Panamax 5100 | OPPO UDP-203 | LG OLED55B7
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#84875 - 10/11/10 10:08 AM
Re: Ready by Christmas?
[Re: gonk]
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Gunslinger
Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 131
Loc: Winnipeg, MB, Canada
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One drawback to setting the player to 480p is that it'll scale BD's down to 480p as well. It would be an interesting experiment, but might not be a good long-term solution. Providing it's worth the trouble from a PQ perspective, it's easy enough to toggle through the available resolutions using the remote. I certainly wouldn't suggest leaving the "default" resolution at 480p for BDs, although for a 50" 768p plasma viewed at 10' or more, I think many would be surprised at how small a difference the lower resolution might make to image quality. I compared 1080p to 720p when I set up my oppo and couldn't really see any difference but I never used 480p. I'll check it out if I get a chance and report back. I suspect the scaling capability of my Pioneer is pretty good since I couldn't see any difference between 720p or 1080p from the oppo to 768p. I suspect I won't see any difference going between 480p and 768p but I'll check. Thanks for indulging me. The Pioneer plasmas are indeed often singled out as having good scaling capability although I suspect that's also true of many others. It's deinterlacing (especially for 480i) that seems to cause problems for many.
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