If the 997 is released soon, near in capabilities to the concept put forward years ago within Outlaw, and even if some people are ready for an upgrade, I think most will find themselves at a tipping point: Do I want a Trinnov-capable platform that perhaps has not otherwise advanced in two years, or does the perceived need for capabilities in directions the industry may be going, like PLIIz, push me beyond a 997 ‘aged before it releases’ platform toward something else? In Outlaw’s favor, a Trinnov system may do something great for some customers, and, since many studios have rarely produced content beyond 5.1 anyway, 9.1 (or a 7.1 that is 5.1 plus height) may be as nearly invisible as 7.1 has been in most consumer content distribution. The majority of content may be years and years away from genuinely moving beyond 5.1 with any gusto – then again it might be soon. In sales, what buyers expect to see doesn’t have to have a firm connection to reality. I did not miss the THX logo on my Outlaw gear, but many are influenced by such things. Consumer attention is almost entirely one of perception and anticipation, so the purchase will swing more on what is ‘believed’ than what will actually become reality. If PLIIz gets enough buzz, the 997 as originally conceived will arrive appearing, with regard to sales/marketing, behind the times even if it is spot-on because the latest touted ‘next thing’ ends up as ‘vaporware’. In Saloon fashion, purchasers who don’t have the patience to see how things settle out will be indirectly responding to: “place your bets.”

If the 997 has an even more significant delay, perhaps it’s time to scrap some of the circuitry that won’t be up to consumer-perceived ‘next gen capabilities’ in favor of including capabilities other brands have brought to market during the last two years plus a Trinnov system in the same platform. If I were Outlaw and ever dealt with the same external team members involved in *cough* bringing the 997 to market, I’d want a stepped ‘money back’ time-sensitive performance clause added to any contracts.

A while after previous Outlaw processors came to market, the prices of those processors dropped in order to maintain the ‘value’ of a platform that is not updated annually, which makes sense to me. If the 997 capabilities are not revised to meet advances in market expectation, will the price of the 997 need to drop in a ‘value timeline’ fashion, as if it had been widely introduced for sale within the initially planned release dates? If so, buyers may actually be beyond the point where the usual first $100 price drop happens (whether a price drop actually occurs or not) before the first widely available unit ships.

As expressed by others, I’m also cheering for Outlaw. Hopefully they’ll get through this processor upgrade round somewhere near to breaking even, resuming normal profits on whatever the next Outlaw processor will be.

I to have been waiting patiently for Outlaw to come thru with the 997. The idea of Trinnov-capability interests me but not to the extent that I have read on this forum from other Outlaws.
I have the 990/7700 combo and I am very pleased with the sound calibration after using a digital spl from radio shack.
My Fathoms have there own calibration system and they work well with the 990.

For me to step-up to the 997 I am hoping for something more dynamic even more than XM/Sirius radio since you have to pay a monthly fee. That feature to me is not a big deal especially since I have recently purchase a iPhone and downloading all of my music and listening to it thru my Home Theater system. With the capability of numerous apps the iphone for me at home listening is more to my liking.

Better processing than the 990 capable of contending with the likes of MacIntosh,Classe' that to me is more important.

Sherwood jumped in way over their heads on this deal. Somebody, some where got sold a Bill of Goods on the capabilities of their employee's.Sherwood has never had the People in place to do this kind of implementation. The logistics and correlation of different Manufacture's parts and the intergration of those parts, if it hasn't already is on the brink of turning them into Alchoholic's. I think They have had to go outside for help on this project. if they haven't already. They should have Bit the bullet long ago and said We don't know WTF we are doing, and got outside assistance. Hell, half of our industry is trying to pull this OFF on the Fly.
So Don't Blame Outlaw.

Rubbersoul,
If you don't mind my asking, how do you like the iphone's sound quality over your system compared to regular cd? Assuming you're streaming wireless with chordette/bluetooth?
Thanks,
grog

Here is why I "blame" Outlaw, actually I don't blame them but I do hold them responsible for everything they sell .... go to the home page and read the "about" section. In that section you will find these quotes:

**We are designers and engineers. First we spec and design our products, and then we locate the best possible venue for their manufacture.

**Since the design and manufacture of the products that Outlaw sells is under our direct control, we are more familiar than anyone else with how these products work.

**Together, we have been involved in the design and manufacturing of over 150 different audio and video products.

**We all wanted to design and manufacture products without corporate interference, and deliver them directly to the consumer.

**Our high performance products are available to you exclusively on the Internet.

**While there are other Internet retailers that sell consumer electronics products, most of them are merely reselling the same merchandise that is commonly available through traditional sales channels.


It seems there is minimal design or specifying going on with some of these newest products. Offerings from Onkyo, Cue, Velodyne, Qsonix, Vudu, Grado, Atlantic Technology and Terra sure seem like products sold by typical online retailers and less like exclusive designing. The 970 and 1070, both of which seem to be highly designed by Outlaw, are now discontinued and should be moved down to the correct section.
I hope the 997 gets released soon and is a success but I would also like to see Outlaw return to it's roots and start offering truly innovative designs. Stop badge engineering someone else's design. Remember how unique the ICBM was? How about the analog bass management on the 950? Think more along those innovative lines and less about another version of the LFM.

Keta,

Thanks for your post. You raised some interesting philosophical issues. As we speak I am on my way to CES for a whole host of meetings for involving Outlaw, Atlantic and a few other companies.

In actuality, due to the way we market and the known level of quality of our customer base (Yes other companies visit the Saloon to see what we are doing and what our customers want) we have been approached by others to market specific products that they believe are ideal for Outlaw. Many companies wanted a targeted marketing approach.

Some examples:

Terra: They named us the only authorized Internet retailer of their outdoor speakers

Vudu: They approached us and put together a unique (at the time) bundle of free movies for outlaw customers.

Cue: Listened to our ideas on making a special version of their radio with improvements to listening modes. (They are now requesting that they be allowed to incorporate the ideas in the Outlaw version in their own model by late spring)

Oppo: We are very close with these people. They (among other things, have given us an education on Anchor Bay video processing.) As a result of this relationship, we are one of only three companies outside of themselves that is invited to offer the limited edition of the BDP-83 Blu Ray player.

Onkyo: Well that one was our idea because we knew that the 997 would be quite late due to glitches and other issues at Inkel (that our completely out of our control.) Many customers who could not wait have taken advantage of our acquiring the 886’s and we have now virtually tied up the market on the remaining new units with all the latest software.

.

In this world of rapidly changing technologies there are few companies that can totally develop a platform on their own. It costs well over one million per platform, if you include the software development and approvals. Furthermore, by the time one delivers, the technology has moved on again (HDMI 1.4 anyone?).

So Outlaw as with a few other online companies has technology and marketing partners. While we would like to have everything with our brand name it is virtually impossible unless you remain fairly narrow in a rapidly changing product environment.

So this week, we and other Outlaws are exploring opportunities for our customers and yes some of them will be unique to Outlaw. (Without talking out of school since it has already been written about in the audio press H-PAS speaker technology is in our future.) Work continues on the 997 (Suffice it to say, we will not release it until it is totally vetted) and there are real good surprises coming that no one sees coming as of today.

Will we continue to offer special products from our colleagues? Yes, but where possible, we will put a special Outlaw touch on them.
That is it I am on an early morning plane. Happy New Year everyone and thanks again Keta for raising the issue

Thanks for the very interesting post, Peter. Have a good week at CES.

I wonder if the "surprises" are part of the 997 platform or some other equipment offerings?

I am leaving Wednesday for CES myself. I am sure there will be many manufactures that have New Stuff on the way. The problem with most of this, is that the Industry has not established a working Platform that all can adhere to. You can spend Millions in development, just to have everything changed in Mid Stream. The Ultra Expensive Product manufactures are really feeling the Pinch. It's going to be a tuff two-three years getting everybodies stuff to work together. (Correctly)Our Industry is a very difficult Buisness right now.

With resources being limited across the high end industry, I wonder why everyone is striving to produce a do-everything pre-pro.
The idea of a component system is to be able to marry "best of breed", specific purpose modules togeather to produce the desired result without a lot of duplication and replace them individually without scrapping the whole works.
It would be difficult to put togeather a system today that didn't have video processing capabilities in at least 3 of the components ( source, pre-pro and TV).The same is becomming true of audio processing as players like the Oppo BDP-83SE do a bang-up job with D/A conversion in all formats.
The inclusion of redundant capabilities merly makes each device more complicated , expensive to purchases , and difficult to intergrate.
I will conceed that the attraction of single-wire HDMI hook-up is a selling point, but I for one don't see it as all that necessary.
As near as I can tell, the only thing that the 997 will do that an OPPO BDP mated with a 990 won't is equalization.
I'd love to see a stand alone full capability equalizer ( kind of a full range SMS) offered
. This would make more sense to me than a full capability pre-pro that's continually on the verge of obsolesence.