A recent post in the "200 Feedback" area of the Saloon, "Found this on Audiogon," prompts me to think ...

There are 10,001 modifications that folks are offering out there. Some make sense. Some just move the quality of a piece of gear from 99.5% to 99.7% for an exhorbitant cost. Others may actually lower the quality or cause problems. And a WHOLE lot of them are just BS to convince those of us in the quest for near-perfection to part with our $$$ so that it becomes their $$$$$$.

So how do we sort through it all?

For example, an article somewhere may say, in essense, "Everyone knows that XYZ speakers are great except for the crossovers. Buy our crossovers instead! Ours are better!"

Further research reveals that not "everyone" is convinced of the crossover flaw. Several reviewers really liked the XYZ Model One speakers just as they were, "stock." The XYZ company claims to have hired a fantastic designer and say "all is wonderful."

So, no matter what the gear is, we all don't have exotic test labs ... how do you decide who to believe and where to put your $$$?

Feel free to contribute good answers as well as your 'wildest' story of a claim by someone offering a mod!

[This message has been edited by bestbang4thebuck (edited June 11, 2003).]

I would say that unless you have a lot of technical knowledge of the subject (like SH), or have a trusted friend who does, that you should forget about modding. The money spent on modding indiscriminatly could much better be spent on upgrading some other part in your system, or on buying new CDs or DVDs to enjoy.

As I pointed out in the original modding thread, you should not consider modding unless there is something specific that you feel the stock gear is not providing and that you want to get.

If you're just trying to get a better product than the stock one, why not instead consider just buying a better product in the first place. Outlaw makes fantastic amplifiers, but if money is absolutely no object, I'm sure there are better ones out there somewhere ...

Jeff

Jeff summed it up very well. I would only add that before any mod, you demand a detailed and specific technical expalanation as to what exactly the mod is supposed to do and why. If they use vague terms and aren't specific, run away as fast as you can!

Nothing substantial to add here except that I enjoy modifying to a certain extent and consider it another extension of this hobby. First my comments are music related systems only. I want to make that clear as we are on a HT forum. You should be very familar with the sound of the stock unit in your system before even considering a modification. Know what you want to accomplish and do as much of the work as you can yourself. Or as Jeff points out and as I have found useful in all electronics, have that friend that knows it all and can either do the job or bail you out. It is nice if the friend is single and has no life and if your wife will cook for him while he works (DM if you are reading this I am joking, I love you, the steaks are on the grill). If you go to an outside service know the people involved or get to know them well before utilizing the service. Be able to recognize that you are getting what you paid for in parts and service. The price point at which you are modding is a factor also. You must consider how much you have involved and how much you want to spend. As I have said before I would consider a mod to a $300 solid state amp but not to a $1000 one. I don't have the experience with solid state and don't want to take the chance on the warranty, and I frankly don't have the time. I just bought a sub that 10 years ago I would have built myself. Modifications can be fun, it can provide a benefit and to take the other view from Jeff it can save you money over new equipment by accomplishing some of the same things at a lower cost than a new purchase. But there is risk involved. It is not for eveyone. It can be a big pain in the rear and you need to allocate time for the project. Also you never get your money back in the resell unless you are extremely lucky. People are very skeptical about mods in purchasing used equipment.

Now I have another suggestion. If you really think you want to do something with electronics or speakers, first buy a simple kit. Start out with one with low cost and ease in build, Say the Bottlehead Foreplay preamp, or the Parts Express BR speaker kit, I think both are around $150. Both of these are suppose to be relatively easy and supply you everything you need. They have wonderful forums and support people if you get in trouble. If in 2 months you are struggling with this, or it is still sitting in the box waiting for you to get started, forget modifications. It won't work for you. If you brezze though this and love doing it and enjoy the work, then tackle something complex or some of your own inexpensive equipment. Just my opinions, and we know what opinions are like

[This message has been edited by OFCCM (edited June 11, 2003).]

I'm in complete agreement. It's a bloody shame that more equipment isn't available in kit form. It's a fun and rewarding passtime that can save a bunch of money. And as a side benefit, as you're building the kit and see something that can be done better than "stock", it's easy to do at that point. Companies like Heathkit and Eico are sorely missed, but there are still some good alternatives out there, and more than a few of them just so happen to be selling tube kits, so you're getting a double dose benefit, in addition to the fun of building it yourself. Try this route if you have the time and inclination, and I guarantee you that you will be happy you did.

Now maybe if Outlaw could offer kits.....I'm not holding my breath; I was never successful in talking them into including a vaccum tube stage into their new products

I was exposed to do-it-yourself kits way back when I was a wee laddie. Some time in the early 60's my father built four items, three from Heathkit. The Heathkit items were a tube-based receiver/phono preamp, a tube-based 25 watt mono amp and a Klipsch designed four-way floor-standing loudspeaker consisting of a two-way shelf unit (8" direct radiator plus ~2x5" horn) sitting on a frequency range extender unit (15" direct radiator and upper-end tweeter). The cabinets for the direct radiators were folded horn resonators that loaded the back of each driver. The horn loading for the 15" driver relied on corner placement to complete the horn structure. At the time, the 40Hz-16KHz range was monstrously impressive for a home system. Sound level output per watt was very efficient. The other item was a turntable kit, I think by H H Scott (I wasn't paying attention to brand names at 8 years old).

Between that and a grandfather that was an EE, I was 'severely bitten' by the DIY audio bug and a quest for the best (high fidelity) bang for the buck.



[This message has been edited by bestbang4thebuck (edited June 11, 2003).]

When I was very young, there was a "Hi-Fi nut" down the street. I loved to go to his house and hear his huge speakers (which were, no coincidence, Altecs) and McIntosh amps. He played things like trains running through the room. It made a lifelong impression on me (obviously!)

I was a do-it-myselfer waaaay back then, too. I built several kits; a Dynaco PAT-5 preamp and AF-6 tuner, and a pair of Southwest Technical Products Universal Tiger amps (familiar to Popular Electronics readers).

My main source was a Dual 1229 turntable (complete w/flip-out base storage and folding dustcover) w/a Shure V-15 Type III cartridge. Speakers were a pair of Rectilinear III's (nicknamed Highboys after the Lowboys came out).

Oh, let us not forget the Koss Pro-4 AAA's.

------------------
Larry Fine
www.fineelectricco.com
My system

[This message has been edited by Larry Fine (edited June 12, 2003).]

I look at it a little differently. I enjoy doing my own minor mods such as putting in chassis damping on CD and DVD players, using different vibration control under TT and other electronics (yes, even amps), using top clamps, etc.

I look at these tweaks as experiments, and I do them to try and improve the overall sound, to try and learn from them as experiments and because I enjoy it.

When I have equipment modded, I do it for the same reasons. Therefore, I have only had mods done to equipment thatI have had in my system for a while. I am also prepared to not like the mod and get rid of the piece. This has happened twice out of about 10 modifications I have had done over the years.

If you are worried about getting your money back by selling the piece later then modding may not be for you. In my experience the return from selling has always been a lower percentage of the total cost for modded pieces. For me it was not a big deal since I enjoyed the experience, the change and the information I learned from the process. I view modding as another method for upgrading/changing your system and its overall sound.

So my advice is to do it if you enjoy it, realize it is a gamble (but so is swapping out components) and don't develop an ulcer worrying about it too much. As always YMMV