Hey All,

I am now so pleased to report the system is up yet not complete.

Unlike many of you HT types, I am an audiophile. This is my first try at HT system yet Music is what drives me and is my #1 love.

Let me fully tell you about my system and it stand now. I am not using a rack of any type. I have three 60 inch Long Pine wood shelves on the back wall.

The bottom shelves in the middle has my Belkin PureAV PF60 Power console. To the right on the bottom is the Denon 3930CI DVD universal Player.

At the far right of the middle shelve is the loved 1070. The Ascend 340C center channel takes up the middle of the second shelve. I still have not put any signal into the Ascend. I have the Ascend HTM-200s for rears and their speaker cable.

Today was supposed to be the day they go up yet my friend who was to assist me and who also is selling me Alon 2 Mk2 loudspeakers is with his girlfriend.

The Alons are using the speaker cable designed for them, Black Orpheus 10 foot bi-wired. I have Signal cables Silver Resolution IC's from the Denon to the 1070. For a sub, I am using the HSU VTF-2 Mk2 powered subwoofer and the Signal cables 8 foor subwoofer mono IC. Both my ICs and sub cable are using the Eichman bullet plugs.

I needed Steve @ Outlaw to help me find the connection that I was lacking. For the first few days, all I could enjoy was classical recordings, esp Orchestral. I could not play any Rock and Roll and had to stick with audiophile recordings. I have placed the Alons with 45 inches from the back of the cabinet (Not the drivers) to the wall. This opened up the sound and made me feel better. Still I was not pleased. I know the sound of these spekers and my mids and highs were not even close to what I thought I could achieve.

My Denon 3930CI is an audiophile grade unit unlike a lot of the DVD players I feel many of you HT people use. This unit features twin Burr Brown PCM-1796 24bit/192kHz DACs which are current, not low voltage type Dacs. IMHO, these and the rest of the Digital to Analong circuitry and superior to the ones in the wonderful 1070. Understand this is a MSRP $1500 (I did not pay that much) unit so expect some high end components. Also, IMHO, for Outlaw Audio to use this type of setup would cause them to raise their price beyond the 990 Pre/processor.

I am using my old Illuminati D-60 Digital coax from the Denon's Digital Out to the Outlaw 1070.

I have had nothing but trouble playing Movies yet when I could get them to play, even in two channel with this sub I was extremely pleased. I had to tone the sub down to 8:30 or my room would shake.

I spoke with Steve and told him my situation. Since my front end uses such a a good ANALOG out, I had to remove the IC's from the CD input and place them in the multi-chanell DVD input then use the DVD input and press the 7.1 button on the remote. This uses a bypass mode and a fixed crossover at 80 HZ. You have to switch the toggle on the back to the uppermost position. Within 30 seconds of playing the first sone I was back on the phone trying to get Steve.

I heard a big difference and enjoyed yet still I knew it could be better. Pink Floyd is my favorite band and their hit Time really tells the story for me. I checked with a buddy who is an electical Engineer and Audiophile and he told me give the Denon a break in of 100 hours, the electolytic capacitors need to break in.

Boy was he right. A few days later after I was over my neurotic begavior, I started listening to music that wasn't classical yet still audiophile grade.

I tried Muddy Waters Folk Singer (MFSL UltraDisc II). Good Morning Little School is a track many of my former audio club members would play.

I was so pleased the way this sounded. Muddy was open and natural sounding, I could not tell the speakers were in the room. Next up was some ELP which was fair at best. I then played Cat Stevens, the very best of. Some of these tracks sounded really good, I mean I was so into it, singing along and rocking. Pleased, I broke out Disc 1 of the Doors , Live at the Aquarius Theatre, second performance. Wow was I shocked. Morrison sounded eerie and Densmore, Manzarek and Krieger were really sounding good.

Finally I was enjoying the sound quality. The next day was a weekend and I had the chance to put some volume into the playback so I broke out Led Zeppelin II (1994 Remaster) and cranked out WLL and Bring it On Home. The dynamics and power of this quartet back from late 1969 still makes me get really into their rhythym. For a rock Cd that sounds fair at best, I was real pleased. Now it was time to try the famous Bootleg of LZ at the fillmore West 4/27/69. Much of this famous concert is a SBD and man oh Man, Bonzo and Page were in my living room. The immense power and majesty of what is considered by many to be one of their finest moments was breath taking. You Shook me, I Can't Quit You baby and OMG, How many More Times was causing me to rock hard like when I was a teenager.

Finally the SQ was there!!!! No doubt, the input change and Time for the Denon and IC's to break in were the two needed ingredients.

I can play any orchestral recording I have and get wonderful, open sound and that much desired depth of soundstage. Even some of my Rock recordings are giving me depth. Pink Floyd , "Is there anybody Out there" live was never sounding like this before.

You want Depth, Try two renditions of Shostakovich Symphony # 8, the third movent, "Allegro Non Troppo". The Decca London 1983 with Bernard Haitink as the conductor when played on a good system (beware of ear bleeding)gives such an open deep stage you get awe inspired by the World War II war horse song. The remasterd version is on a 2006 11 box CD set. I suggest you get that one since newer matsering techiques now are so far ahead of the 1983 brick wall filters.

I also have Shostakovich Symphony # 8 on the Melodia label with Gennadi Rozhdestvensky as the condutor with USSR Minstry of Culture Symphony Orchestra. This second version is Russians playing a 20th century Russian Composer so It may be more accurate and it's openeness and depth may even be better.

I am digging the sound with two channels and the sub. The Alons are full range and can play cleaning at 40HZ. the HSU is behind the right channel and a little to the side. The bass soundsd like it is in the center and causes a more open soundstage.

I hear music in this syem. I do not hear what normally I would call Solid State and digital. I have wonderful Lows and great openess.

What can I say, I am so pleased and back to my Audiophile days. I am now running a solid state receiver, yes receiver unlike a decade ago where I had a tube preamp and hybrid power amp, both with Mullard tubes.

I still feel the syetm is breaking in and I will expect the sound to improve even more as I approach 100-150 hours.

If I cou'd single out anything I could say I want a little more liquidty in the midrange and some fuller extension in the highs. Of course I am comparing this $899 reciver to several thousand dollars of audiophile tube equipment with NOS tubes so Kudos to the Engineers, Peter Tribeman, Scott Jackson, Steve and the others up there in Easton Massachusetts.

I am annoyed that I have to send in my Denon 3930Ci for repair. I undertand the design, there are two lasers and the second one for DVDs/SACDS is not working. Denon is a typical Japanese smug company that is being difficult. I will have to send it to them with some paperwork I am waiting for. I will not have to pay for the repair, only shipping one way.

My 1070 is used and I am the registered owner. My Ascend 340C is used and I am the registered owner. I caled HSU rsearch to ask some advice and mentioned I have a VTF sub yet no Bass test CD. I just got that CD 20 minutes ago.

My Receiver which sounds like SEPARATES, my sub and all speakers save my fronts and all MY ICS (I have three pair of PCAS to use for Multi channel Playback) are manufactured and supported by AWESOME, totally devoted SUPERB companies.

I highly, highly recommend Outlaw Audio to all you out there who read these forums and are mulling and pondering on making the decision to get an Outlaw.

Sincerely, One ficklle, pleased Audiophile.

I must extend my personal thanks to many of you on this saloon. Way back in the beginning and as of late, I say thanks to CHAS for his help and feedback. Videodrome and Waveright, RedsinPa and Laventura deserve a hand too.

My new buddy Aaron deserves a huge hand in me getting this up and running thd way I want. I feel lucky to know him and be able to reach out to him and Now I am helping him reach new heights of enjoyment as he uses the same DVD player and Power Console.

From these Outlaw forums, no greater appreciation that I feel compelled to say is deserved by the peerless, so accomodating and willing to share his experiences and technical understanding.

For anyone out there who knows these forums and to any newbies, There is a man who is so good and so helpful, I can't say enough about him.

Of all the thanks I have to say, no one deserves more than the almighty "Gonk." Thank You Jim, you are the best!

What do you al think of me now?

I am the Lizard King, i can do anything! (Jim Morrison).

Hey Lizard King,

I've been waiting to hear your impressions of the 1070 and I appreciate the detail you put into your review. When I had the 1070 I didn't really understand the benefit of hooking the CD player to the multichannel input and using the crossover switch and I never tried it - I probably would have spent more time listening to music if I had!

Unfortunately every positive review I read of the 1070 makes me want to order another...I've tried three receivers since the 1070 and though they all have their good points, none of them have impressed me with sound quality like the 1070.

Good luck with the Denon repair, and let us know when you get the kinks out of the surround system...I think you'll be equally impressed with movies on the 1070.

Let the music play !
Oh Joy! Oh ! Sweet Bliss !
I'm glad to see you're enjoying yourself Liz...

The lizard kind's system has risen from the void! Heck of a write-up, Paul.

Hmmm,3 of the people I gave praise too have responded. So tell, what do you think of my post?

Great write up, Lizard King. And thanks for the kind words.

Like you, I cut my teeth on good two-channel gear, including a fair share of tube equipment, in my earlier days in the hobby. So I think our points of reference are very similar. Likewise, my expectations walking into my system overhaul was to find reasonably priced gear that would (#1) deliver good quality stereo music playback, and (#2) could do doubly duty as a HT system.

Well, Outlaw certiuanly delivered. Although we differ in terms of the fact I am using the 970 as opposed to the 1070, from a Pre/Pro standpoint, we are using the same platform and I couldn't be happier. If there are any weak links currently in my system, the 970 is not one of them. In bypass mode, the unit simply "gets out of the way" of the music. And the well executed 80Hz analog crossover is perfectly suited to my speakers and allows the McCormack amp to really sing without, as I feared, being colored by a pre/pro that is less than half its price. That is a real testament to the sound-for-the-dollar you get with Outlaw products.

I hope you continue to enjoy your new system!

Congratulations to you Liz -

First off, it becamse apparent when reading your posts that you are far more experienced with different audio equipment than I am. I am the lucky son-in-law of someone who bought me my 1070 as a birthday gift. Since receiving my 1070, and being a member here, I'm learning so much about this. Your write has truly convinced me i need to spend more money. Thanks a lot! :p

Seriously though, congrats on a great purchase. It's nice to hear someone with the background you have compliment the same equipment I own. It makes me think I'm truly lucky to be an owner and pushes relative rookies like me to learn more, experiment more, and listen more. I'm buying a new house soon with hardwood floors throughout. I'm so excited to get some new speakers and start the 1070 experiment over with a clean slate.

Cheers!

Wow... and my friends think I'm crazy.

Just messing around, great review.

Liz,

How is the Harmony working with the 1070?

Hey Chas,

The Harmony is good. You have to play around with it from time to time to customize it the way you want. Overall it is good.

Hey All,

I finall hooked up my Rear speakers. I feel fronts (Alons) and a lot betetr then my center. For music DVD such as teh US Vertigo, I just changed center width from 3 to 5. What do you all use for center width?

I order a HDTV so I have not set the speakers distance yet. How much better once I use this seeting can I expect?

I've used a center width of 4 or 5 a pretty fair bit. Keep in mind, though, that center width only matters when using Pro Logic IIx Music and a two-channel source (stereo analog, PCM stereo, or Dolby 2.0).

Even with the TV still missing, I'd go ahead and set speaker distances and levels. It only takes a few minutes and the benefits can be worth it.

You started this thread by stating you're an audiophile, yet are looking for pseudo-surround instead of plain stereo for music? I would have expected you to go stereo bypass into floorstanders or, if you had small speakers and sub, to use 7.1 bypass with only the analog crossover...

Hey Liz...just wanted to check in now that you've had the unit for awhile. Give us an update on your likes, dislikes, etc. when you get a chance!

HI Chas.

I just hooked up my HDTV today with service. Changed the setting in the HDTV box to use Dobly Digital Out with the SPDIF. I have my Illuminati D60 hooked up and Wow!

The 1070 is a Great unit, I am having so much fun with it!

Did you ever get your Denon fixed?

Hi Chas,

Yes, I received the denon 3930CI last week. They had sent me a refurbished unit that did not work so I called and complained. I have my original back with a full year warranty.

I was listening last night to SRV, Couldn't stand the Weather remastered, it was awesome.

The Mets game in Surround sound , Donly digtal was intense when the crowd was cheering.

Glad Denon took care of you finally. Are you still listening to CD's in two channel through the multichannel input using the crossover switch?

Hi chas,

I may hook the mult channel later. Have not have the chance yet. I love listening to HD baseball games and Dolby Digital through the 1070.

Was your 1070 'new' or 'B stock'?
Do you have the dreaded 'no audio' problem?

I was 'really' considering the 1070 or 970 until I started reading about this no audio thing. The price drop on the 990 muddies the water too. I'm going to replace my aging Sony DPL receiver and get a large screen HDTV by summer's end. I managed to get three Niles Audio SI-245 amps (2 ch, 45W/ch 8ohm RMS) and an SI-275 (2ch 75w/ch 8ohm RMS) 'out of the garbage' (I work for Niles) so the pre-pro route is tempting. (I DO have to repair these units. Mostly find replacement heat sinks, since they were removed for prototyping work. I even bought a cheap band saw to cut down raw heatsink stock to make replacements. I have two more to fix.).

I wish someone at Outlaw would chime into the Saloon and give us an honest update on the 1070/970 dropout problem/fix. Right now I'm keeping the 970/1070 on the back-burner on my short list. I would jump on a used 950 or 990 at the right price (and if a B stock 990 shows up I'll probably have a nervous fit). Otherwise a high end Onkyo (700-800 series) is possible.

I do NOT have the No Audio issue. I did apply the latest firmware before using the 1070. I have a digital coaxial cable conencting the Explorer 4250HD to a digital coaxial input on the 1070.

Seems the 4250 is basicly a cablebox / cable modem.

I'm guessing my cable company (comcast) will supply an hd cable box with digital audio output, so it should work for me too.

Maybe this no audio thing is not as widespread as I feared.

The 4250 is an HD cable box - you should get something similar from your cable company.

I am an Audiophile !

The comments here about the use of the analog bypass with the 80Hz crossover reminds me of a recent enlightening experience. A short while ago I upgraded my DVD player because I needed 480i HDMI output (not an easy spec to find, by the way) and one of its side features was SACD capability. Since I had plenty of high-quality analog cables lying around I connected up the 7.1 inputs (actually just 5.1). I bought a few SACDs when they were on sale and got the showpiece ones like Dark Side of the Moon and Brothers in Arms but for the most part noticed that most of the releases I was coming across were just reissues of old RCA 2 and 3 track recordings from 40+ years ago so I really did not fall under the SACD spell. In the meantime, I was using the digital audio connection for listening to regular CDs as before. Usually DPLIIx-M, sometimes just stereo depending on how retro I wanted to feel. Then one day I forgot to toggle off the 7.1 setting after listening to an SACD. To my surprise the CD played through the left and right channels of the 7.1 analog inputs. Even if it hadn't had been a surprise that it would work that way I probably would have immediately switched back to the digital input thinking that that has to be the superior connection, right? And the more speakers the better, right? So, I was inadvertently playing the CD through the bypass input and I was playing a cut I listen to regularly: Coltrane's interpretation of My Favorite Things from Newport '63 but it could have been any tune of which one knows all the nuances. Some ways into it I realized it sounded like I was there in person. I also enjoyed listening to it louder than usual. I was hearing detail I hadn't noticed before. My speakers had long since passed their break-in period so that couldn't be it. I had made no other changes in components. It was then I noticed I had left the 7.1 setting toggled on. After some A/B testing revealed that was the source of my new sonic satisfaction I now play all my CDs as straight stereo through the 7.1 inputs. Whatever inhancements the DPLIIx-M processing provides are trumped by the utter transparency of the bypass input. Your mileage may vary and for many this may be a given but I thought I wold share my Plato's Allegory of the Cave moment.
:-)

jlib:

I came to the same conclusion...On a recommendation from the guy who sold me my reciever...I tried listening to my CD's through the analog connections of my DVD player...What a difference

I too listened to my previous CD's through the digital connection in 2.1 and 2.0. The sound was good...but nothing compared to direct analog. The detail, clarity of the voices, and overall sweet sounds blew away anything I was listening to previously.

Since CD's are digital, this would seem to imply that the DA converters in the CD player are better than those in the receiver? Or is it that the processor is adding unwanted 'color' to the mix?

In these cases, the reason that analog is working better is most likely the result of a source component offering higher quality DAC's and the 1070's analog bypass modes (either the 7.1 direct input or the analog bypass mode with the stereo analog inputs) offering a good, clean signal path all the way from inputs to amp outputs.

Hey All,

Writing here from a wireless connection. My buddy also uses a Denon DVD player. The Dacs in these players are very good so we all hook up the player to the multi channel dvd input and then hit the 7.1 button on the remote. Trust me, this sounds much better than the cd input.

Liz out

Just had the Denon 3930CI DVD player modified! The dynamics now in this system is awesome! Gone is the digital sound.

As this breaks is, It sound like analog! I now use the Denon DVD plater to decode mult-channel movie audio streams and the sound is fuller, clearer, more dynamic!


Liz Out

Who did the mods?

http://www.sacdmods.com/index.html

FYI, this is now his reference machine Chas! The Denon 3930CI!