Has anyone compared the 990 to say a krell hts 7.1 or a Meridian 568.2? I know many have compared to lesser equipment but I was wondering how much of a difference there was. The krell costs $8000 but you would be suprised what the dealer cost is and how much they mark up their product. So the build cost is much less than dealer cost. This gets me thinking that the cost of building these are not much higher than the 990 as it seems.

I haven't compared these, but I'm curious - what is the dealer cost for the Krell?

Less than $3500

The reason I asked is because I am considering downgrading my system to save a little money. For all those who would be interested I might just by the 990 to do a direct comparison with my existing pre/pro. It is the Meridian 861. I know the price differences are a LITTLE OFF but I am curious. If the outlaw 990 does not sound good enough compared to it I was considering the 568.2 or the krell which both would save me money.

I haven't really seen any comparisons of this type. I'd expect that the Meridian will sound better (Meridian charges what they do in large part because they build good stuff, after all), but we haven't seen any first-hand reports and as always we're entering the realm of diminishing returns, so the question becomes how much those benefits are worth to your pocket book. If you don't mind "gambling" the shipping costs, the best bet is the one you're already considering: order a 990 and try it for a few weeks.

That is what I want to do. You are right about Meridian making great gear, but they should for the cost. I think I will order one next week. I guess I will be the first to try this weird experiment. One of the least inexpensive pre/pro's vs one of the most expensive. I will test strictly dts and dd. I feel trifield is the best dsp for music by far in my experience. The most natural anyway. I want to see if my usual bunch of guys can tell a big difference or not between the 2. I am looking for dynamics, separation of the detail. In my experience krell and meridian do it the best but I have not heard everything. When I finally order it I will post a new topic meridian 861 vs 990

I look forward to the comparison. I was considering an Anthem AVM30 or a Statement D1 but ultimately decided to go with the 990 and save the difference toward a future speaker upgrade, where for my system I think I would get a better ROI.

My system consists of 7 M&K S-5000 THX speakers with a SVS PB12/Plus/2, currently an ADA amplifier providing 350 watts per channel, A momitsu dvd player as well as a panasonic h1000d, and my Meridian 861. I am waiting for my new Gemstone amp to arrive as well. I want to see if the outlaw 990 with the gemstone would equal or come close to the Meridian and ADA.

That sounds like a very interesting experiment. I'm looking forward to hearing how it shakes out.

It is rare to see that type of review, so yours will be very interesting indeed. The Meridian is a whole different level from the 990, and you should be able to definitely hear the difference. At what reduced level though is "good enough" going to be, hmmm? Remember as you moved up the ladder all the appreciable increases you experienced, will now be reversed. I too just did my own comparison between the 990 and an older NAD pre/pro, mainly for audio reasons (dvd was a no brainer). The Outlaw won and is staying in my system. I did the A/B a little different though, you might want to try. Put the 990 in place of the Meridian for about a week, listen only to it, then take a day off and change back to the Meridian, your "yes or no" about good enough should be instantly apparent. If not, then do same time A/B testing. Look forward to your post. Oh yeah, don't let your bunch of guys know you switched it out.

The guys will have no idea what I am using. my gear is in the back of the theater behind both row of seats. I will just ask them which one was the better experience. Only a couple of them can pick up on little things. I am thinking that the meridian is better than the 990 but the Gemstone maybe better than the ADA(big maybe)so that might make up the difference. I will see. I will replace my 861 with something, the list is Meridian 568.2, krell hts 7.1, outlaw 990, or the emotiva. I need xlr connections.

I just found out that the dealer cost of a krell is $5000. Sorry about the $3500 quote before. I misunderstood him the first time. I am thinking of going with an Emotiva DMC-1. Any thoughts?

The DMC-1 (a rebadged Sunfire) is a good piece of gear, and like the other prominent online companies (Outlaw, SVS, Axiom, OPPO, ...), AV123's customer service is pretty solid. You can see from my SSP Chart how it compares to the 990 from a feature standpoint (the 990 has an edge in that regard). Some folks prefer the DMC-1's sound (although I get the impression it's not by a wide margin), while there have also been a couple folks drop by this forum who passed on it because they didn't like the Sunfire sound.

I am officially down to 3. The outlaw 990, DMC-1, and the Krell showcase. I really don't know what to try. I can't make a move until I sell my Meridian. I thought I was done with this stuff. I appreciate all the advice. I know each owner will have their biased opinions. Are their any inexpensive processors that are truley modular? I love the concept of just sliding out a board and replace it with a new one. I know of Theta and Meridian. Any others?

Modular's always been pretty much restricted to the higher price bracket. Integra's RDC-7.1 is modular, but I don't know that $5,500 is the price range you're looking for.

I recently added the Anthem AVM30 to my HT to replace the Boston Acoustics AVP7 which replaced the 990 which replaced the Yammy 2500. I also added an Emotiva MPS-1 which replaced the BA A7200 which replaced the Outlaw 755 which replaced the Yammy's internal amps.

There was a large difference between the 2500 (when used as a pre/pro only) and the 990 in favor of the 990, a very slight difference I felt in favor of the AVP7 over the 990 (not surprising as they are both built on the same platform), and again a large difference between the AVM30 and the AVP7 favoring the AVM30. This shouldn't be all that surprising when the pricing of these units is examined except for the closeout pricing on the AVP7.

I am very happy with the AVM30 and am no longer even thinking about the audio, just enjoying it. My only upgrade in the area of the processor will be to have the AVM30 upgraded to an AVM50 when the upgrade is available...and when I can afford it... ouch! I think I could actually live with the audio quality of the AVM30 for a long time. The Anthem has excellent sound and more extensive setup options than todays most complex receivers; to ME, this was the best of both worlds.

The MPS-1 is very open and sounds amazing. Channel separation is astounding! It is also a piece of art and truly glorious to look at. I have not tried hooking the Outlaw 755 I still have to the AVM30 yet but may try to do so before selling it to see how it fares as I have compared the 755 and the MPS-1 hooked to the same processor in my setup.

The AVM30/MPS-1 is the best sounding combination of gear I (stressing this is my opinion here) have heard in my HT thus far and I doubt I will ever hear anything better in my room as this was pushing my budget as it was. I'm stopping with this as I no longer feel I'm missing anything now...and if I still am I don't want to know about it...ignorance is bliss!

Of course I still have to figure out what I am going to power zones 2, 3, and 4 with I wish more companies were still making two channel amps. The selection here has really died off in recent years. Maybe I should just use the 755 for two of these zones...I don't know but that seems like overkill to me.

I would be curious to hear your comparison of the Meridian gear to the 990 as I have of course heard excellent things about Meridian. Then again, that may just get me in trouble again.

If I was smart, I would avoid all these forums and enjoy what I have and not look back. I do enjoy comparing different gear though and replacing pieces from time to time. To me it's a part of the hobby of HT.

Peace!

Wow. I am glad I saw your post.. I am considering an AVM 50 or D2 to replace my Sherwood P-965 ( similar to 990) and I was wondering how they might compare.

WOW !!! That's a hell of a ride !
I have a friend who owns a AVM30/PVA-7 set-up
I must admit...it sounds incredible...
audio capabalities appear endless if you keep adding power amps...
but the video switching inabilities...seem like a major drawback for that kind of cash
Do you know the cost of the upgrade to AVM50 ?
Does the AVM50 have the same video switching abilities of the D2 ?
probably a 4 digit $ upgrade on top of the original cost...
Ouch!!! there's no free lunch...
and only one life to live...

Wingnut,

Not to be rude...but there is no comparison between the AVP7 (exact clone of the P965 as far as I know) and the AVM30. The Anthem is simply incredible. If I had to give a percentage of the AVM30's sound quality performance achieved by the AVP7, I would say the AVP7 gives about 65% of the AVM30's performance on movies and about 60% on audio. Details are abundant with the Anthem and and bass is integrated excellently.

Feature-wise there is also no comparison. The AVM30 has things like channel levels memorized by each surround mode, THX processing(highly adjustable as well), you can set the decoding mode for each type of surround format on every different source input, menu is accessable via OSD and the front panel of the unit, two separate speaker configs (one for movies, one for music), etc.

The downside is the cost of the unit compared to the 990, AVP7, P965, etc.


Laventura,

The video switching capabilities are another downside of the AVM30 right now. However, for MY setup the only DVI/HDMI source I have is the Oppo971 and it is connected directly to my SP4805 projector. Everything else is fed via component or S-video (Laserdisc is still hanging in there) and ran through the Anthem.

Anthem is still working on the upgrade for the AVM30 to an AVM50 and thinks they will have it completed in the next 6 months or so. I believe the only major differences between the AVM50 (or upgraded AVM30) and the D2 is that the D2 has upsampling for all channels, DTS 24/96, and dual DSP engines. The cost of the upgrade should be around $1700 (the original price difference between buying the AVM30 or AVM50). It's definately not cheap.

I am wondering how the Gennum scaler in the upgrade would do with the component and S-video from all my sources. From what I have heard and read about the Gennum scaler, probably pretty darn good.

I'm in no hurry though for the upgrade as I need to recover from the AVM30 purchase and don't have more than one source to connect via HDMI right now anyhow.

Doug
The major drawback of the video switching on the AVM30 is that you have to run all your video cables to your display...pretty minimal...
win some, lose some
NO no-audio stuff on the AVM30 ...
and if previous Anthem products are any testimony...
the upgrade should be nothing but stellar ...
but I must confess...that in my small living room...WITHOUT all the tweaks, the certifications, versatility, power and so on...
but let's not forget the kilobucks $$$

my 1070 paired with my powered sub deliver the goods...loud and clear when needed...
Music in stéréo is simple BLISS
The needle-squirting melons in Aeon flux (chapter 4) are everywhere...
I duck everytime...
and if aesthetics are anything...
16 Knobs&Buttons total on the front panel...
give me the ''wet eye'' and...
Life IS good...

I've always heard good things about the Anthems. It was funny, because the one time I heard anything less than positive about them was when someone was demo-ing my system recently and said that it sounded better than the local Anthem dealer's demo room with an AVM-30. It just goes to show that even the best gear needs attention paid to proper setup - based on all the praise that the Anthem processors have received over the years, we had to conclude that the AVM-30 demo setup had some issues.
You could always get one of the 7075's from Outlaw and power three stereo zones with one channel to spare.

Laventura,

I had the 970 at the same time the 2500 and the 990 were in my HT as well. The 970 sounded better IMO than the 2500 with music, but not movies. I did LOVE the way they set the crossover up on the 970/1070 though (other manufacturers should definately take note here). If you want to take it to the next level with 2-channel music, you'll have to give the 990 a try. The 990 does very well with music. I also perfered the appearance of the 970 over the 990...at least when looking at the front of the unit...the back was another story.

Although I feel the AVM30 is definately better than the 990 for both music and movies, I can't argue that the 990 is the better bang for the buck. Just like I'm sure if I heard Meridian or the Lexicon's flagship processors they would best the Anthem, but again, at several times the price.

If it wasn't for these boards and my local hi-fi shops, I probably would have stopped with the Yammy a long time ago. I wouldn't have known there was anything better. Dang all of you!

Enjoy your rig!

Thanks Doug. I pulled the trigger on a D2 today. I must say I am excited to get it.

I envy you wingnut. I would have loved to have the D2, but my budget (or lack there of) simply would not allow it. You'll have to let everyone know what you think of it. Congrats! I think you will be very surprised on the audio and video quality of this unit.

Hi guys,
It has been a while but I did end up trying a Emotiva DMC-1. I like it alot, but after comparing it to the Meridian 861 it was lacking some sound I was used to. My first impressions were the highs were not as clear, not as real. The bass was also less clear, the Meridian had more definition to the bass. I am missing my meridian already. I am still thinking of trying the 990 out. I have read many forums where they say the sherwood is just ok compared to others including the sunfire which the Emotiva is. The emotiva is a great piece of equipment especially for the price but I am just used to the meridian.

The Meridian's a tall order to replace. You might still give the 990 a try - it has a more flexible bass management scheme than the DMC-1, which might help with the clarity of the bass.

I just usually set the crossover to 80 hz for all my speakers since they are all exactly the same. I have read that the 990 has harsh highs. Is this true? My equipment is very neutral and accurate. I lost $100 with shipping the Emotiva so I am hesitate to lose that much again. The goal is to achieve the same sound for less. If this is not possible than I will understand. The Meridian 861 is indeed a very expensive, well built piece. I may have to just try the lesser 568.2 from meridian. that is still more money than I want to spend. That Meridian 861 ruined me.

By the way the Gemstone is better than my ADA amp. Great clarity. It really opens things up. I had the emotiva with the gemstone. My meridian and ada are both sold. What was really dissapointing was when I had my friend come over for a listen(he has the best tested hearing of any of my friends) and he said that with the Emotiva in place it was the worst he heard so far from my theater room(oouch). A major downgrade. His reference point is the Meridian 861 with the Gemstone amp. I would agree with him but not that bad. Hell if you think about it the Meridian is way over priced. The sound out of it though is worth it(used prices, never new).

OK, I just placed my order for the 990. I should have it by Thursday or Friday. If it is not as good sounding as my 861(or good enough) then I will give my honest opinion of the 990 and the Emotiva.

Personally, I have not found the 990's highs to be harsh. On the contrary, I've found the system to be generally neutral. As with speakers, though, there are always some personal taste factors to consider. And of course, there's the TANSTAAFL principle ("there ain't no such thing as a free lunch") - the 990 costs $1100 while the Meridian retails for well over $10,000 (one 2004 review of the v.4 model listed the price at $16,000 to $20,000 depending on extra features included), and even with some large price inflation on Meridian's part figured in you have to sacrifice something to make that large a change in price. As much as I really enjoy my Model 990, I'd expect that there would be some aspects of its sound that will not be able to match the sound from a product with a retail price more than an order of magnitude greater. What I'm not sure about (and you are actually much better positioned to determine than I am) is just how much difference there is - we're inevitably going to be talking about diminishing returns to at least some degree, and possibly even a great degree.

I just did a quick check for what shipping would be from Outlaw to my location, and ground shipping was $40. According to the guarantee page , they pay the shipping back if you don't like it - all you'd be out is $40 and the time spent giving it a try.

I asked them about the shipping as well and they told me $40 only so I went for it. I don't expect the 990 to be equal to the Meridian but I want to come close. The meridian is also modular designed which adds alot to the cost. The Emotiva had a different sound than the Meridian. If the 990 has a similar sound then it might be a keeper. Trust me I want it to do well. The emotiva also gave me a headache at reference levels where the Meridian at reference levels was just WOW. I could have listened all day long that loud. One 15 minute scene with the Emotiva was unbearable at reference levels.

As much as I don't envy you the cabling woes of swapping out surround processors, I will be interested to hear how the 990 fares in your system and to your ears.

After swapping out over 15 processors and that many amps I have become very good at swapping and hooking up surround processors. I don't know why people think meridian is hard to setup and need a dealer, with a computer it is faster than anything. Besides I have never moved my rack into the final position because of this. I only have 2 sources and my sources are going directly to my CRT projector so I only swap out audio.

Gonk have you ever heard Parasound halo gear? If the 990 sounds like their gear then I will keep it as it does have the kind of sound I like.

I have not, sorry...

After I review the 990 I will post or start another thread with the proper title 990 vs or something to that nature.

I always read that the avm30 and 990 are hard to tell apart with sound quality but there are very small differences between the 2 but not worth the price difference. My question is what are the small differences? I like the small differences. The small diferences add up as you add more quality to the system(speaker upgrade Etc...).

MK, awesome, can't wait to see your review. Curious, have you thought about trying the newest Adcom pre-pro?

http://www.adcom.com/prod/shopdisplayproducts.asp?prodid=1150

Adcom's generally known for relatively low cost but very high fidelity components (they use high quality electronics for their price points). I believe the 800HD pre-pro retails in the low-mid 2k range IIRC.

For that price I would look elsewhere.