Hi Guys,

Item One: The first one is more a favor than a question: Would one of you guys do me favor and measure the 990 width at its widest point (faceplate or back end?) to confirm the width of 17.38 inches as stated in the manual. This dimension is critical to me because the 990 has to fit in the wife's entertainment cabinet. The shelf max width "wall to wall" is 17 3/4". The wife and the cabinet need to go but that's a separate issue.

Are the vents on the 990 on top surface only? it ability to breathe on the sides will be about 1/4"

2nd item is a question: What confidence do you guys have that the Outlaw will support the 990 long-term?...Let me explain....

Over the past 3 months or so, I have read many posts from here, AVS, audioholics, etc...all the 990 published reviews plus user reviews here... Based on all these inputs there is no question in my mind that the 990 is a hi-quality pre/pro which cannot be touched at the $1099 price point!

New pre/pro from major players such as Parasound, Anthem, Lexicon etc..was more than I wanted to spend or could really afford without eating only mac & cheese only for 6 months! Arcam avp700 was on my shortlist too, but those unit static freeze issues are unacceptable on a $2200 unit! The fact that the above pre/pros cost 2X - 5X a 990 is not the purpose of my topic.

Now a used AVM20/AVM30 or used Lex DC-2 money-wise is in the ballpark of the 990..the anthems few $100's more, the used lex few $100's less. I don't want to start A better than B, that's old too..the Lex sound etc...There are 1,000+ posts on those issues...

Now to the matter at hand:I'm pretty sure that if I had an issue with my used Anthem AVM30 or Lexicon DC-2 that needed repair, I would get treated like a number. However, electrical tech #4, John Smith, will fix my DC-2. Might keep it 4 weeks, but it will get fixed....

If my 990 requires service, question is..Is Outlaw only a single layer deep across the board? President, head of marketing& sales guy, and 1 tech in the back?...That other post by John about he had OSD troubles...Gonk stated, "one Outlaw employee is taking a few days off...no prob..nobody answers phones til he come back??? That makes me assume Outlaw is 1 layer deep.

I understand the the internet direct part, no factories, no retail store part...makes for a good business model...But if there is that one Outlaw tech in the back, lets call him "Andy", Andy's a real wizard and fixing analog and digital circuit boards...he knows the 990 insides real well!
What if Andy leaves Outlaw for XYZ electronics in near Boston...who will service my 990...head of marketing?

Any thoughts from Gonk or the other Outlaw users that know Outlaw structure well enough that what I describe above has a low or high probability of happening. With Parasound or Anthem, they are 3-4 people layers deep in every area…With that size overhead, that is why the they charge 3,000 + for pre/pro…. so if their Andy tech leaves, they had 3 other guys fixing AVM20’s along side him, they will be short a little while til they train the new guy…. The $1400 used AVM20 or the $900 Lex DC2 is a different story…..

Not looking to down Outlaw, I believe in the internet direct model. I bought Swan Diva speakers, 4 years ago, and Axiom EP500 sub 3 months ago. Both are killer values at their respective price-points.

Any thoughts would be appreciated,

Vince

I have heard no complaints from outlaw customer service, and my understanding is that Outlaw has been gaining a lot of ground in the market. The 990 and the RR2150 have been a huge success for them... I think it is a safe bet they will be around for a while.

Vince,

I just measured my new 990 amd its maximum width is the faceplate which is just over 17.25"

Also, it appears the only ventilation slots are on top.

Can't help with the other questions as I'm a new owner who just received the 990/7125 combo this week...I haven't had the chance to hook up the new gear as of yet. I will spend a few hours on it tomorrow.

Pete

Pete, Thanks for the meas. a hair over 17.25 is ok but less than 17.75" is a must...

and Lanion,

I believe you when you say Outlaw CS is quite good! I just want to make sure that it's not that one tech in the backroom that holds it all together...If they lose fictitious "Andy" in my example, that 990 owners are hosed!!That Outlaw has you covered in 2006, 2007,...2010 etc...

Thanks Vince

As long as the company is in business they I would expect them to honor your warranty.

And as they seem to be doing a fair amount of business, I would say it isn't a large point of worry.

From what I can tell, reading about other people's issues, they send you out a new unit if you have any problems.

If you get a used DC-2 it almost certainly won't have any warranty left on it, if they allow transfers of warranties at all and the DC-2 doesn't do any 7.1 surround processing, if my memory serves.

I suggest that you give the Outlaw a try for 3 weeks or so. As far as I can tell from my experiences with mine, it's a well made unit that is built like a tank. It performs very well and I daresay that you won't find anything that performs as well and has the same features for twice the price.

As for dimensions of the unit, gonk recently did a good post on this at http://ubb.outlawaudio.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?/ubb/get_topic/f/34/t/000555.html

He measured his unit as best as he could.

Regards...

Vince and Petey B, there are a LOT of ventilation slots on the bottom of the 990.

Item One: I can confirm the 17.25 width dimension (faceplace and cabinet sides are the same, and you can see my measurements here . As psyprof1 points out, there are a lot of ventilation slots on the bottom. There are also a few on the rear top, but none on the side. My 990 is in a cabinet that sounds similar to yours, and it has no problems with heat rejection.

Second Item: I believe that Outlaw is a bit more layered than you are guessing. Scott and Steve take the brunt of the tech support calls (hence Scott being busy if Steve's on vacation - especially since I suspect based on the recent increase in site traffic that they may be seeing an increased call volume from people with technical questions before they buy), but that doesn't mean they'd be the ones to pull the cover off a problem unit and make repairs. I don't have any sort of company org chart to refer to, but I think I can be pretty accurate as far as that goes.

As for the reason that Lexicon, Parasound, or Anthem charge 3x or 5x or _x more than the 990 for a processor, I doubt much of it at all has to do with the number of service techs on staff. The bigger driving forces are manufacturing, distribution channel issues, and R&D. A used Lexigon DC-2 may be comparable in cost, but it comes without a score of features that most people expect today (no 5.1 analog input, just to name one, not to mention all the newer processing modes) and as BloggingITGuy points out it's warranty will be long gone. Outlaw minimizes manufacturing by teaming up with the most reliable and cost effective factory for a given project (Anthem, at the opposite end of the scale, owns their own factory and even machines their own faceplates in-house). They take the distribution channel issues such as dealer mark-up out of the picture. Product development still costs them, but they are very selective about features to include and again work to find partnerships that will help with that cost (such as building on the highly-regarded P-965 platform for the 990 or, going back a few years, granting the manufacturer of the 950 - Eastech - the right to offer the 950's platform as a basis for other companies to produce "clones" of the unit, which led to clones and cousins of the 950 from Atlantic Tech, Sherbourn, and Fosgate Audionics).

Stepping back and looking at your question in more general terms, your concern is whether you'll be able to get support for your 990 down the road. There's a five year warranty (transferrable, I might add) and nearly seven years of company history in which they've made a name for themselves as a company with excellent customer service.

Couple points to add to Gonks post:

1) As a previous Parasound owner, if you are not the original owner, you will pay cash for repairs. I have first hand experience (twice) with the same processor. I talked to the tech guys in detail and only one guy took all of my calls over the 4 calls I made.

2) If you buy used brand X you could easily be paying hundereds of $ for your required repairs.

3) Outlaw is not a new start up company anymore!

4) If you compare a $1099 outlaw processor vs a $3000 new processor from Parasound, or Anthem, based only on your concerns of warranty life, you are essentially paying $1900 more for this insurance policy. I realy doubt the risk is that high.

5) Whatever you buy now is going to be "outdated" in a year or two as HD-DVD (Movie & Audio) gains ground. I wouldn't worry past a five year life as I doubt the unit will still be in your possession.

Guys,

Thanks for the double measurement confirmation...

My comment about relating pre/pros that cost $3K and up from the bigger vendors, I meant no direct relation of pre/pro cost to the # of techs, but they carry a bigger organization overall, 3-4 sales/marketing, 3-4 for trade shows etc, and one would assume 3-4 techs...+ magazine ads..Need to cover all those W-2's. The likes of Anthem and Lexicon need to pass those cruise ship costs onto the end-user.

On the other hand, my aunt worked for Harmon Kardon at their main US office on Long Island for 7 years. She was able to get us HK gear for the Japan cost to manufacture price of 60% off MSRP. After 1 year they changed employee policy HK family members pay dealer cost...40% off MSRP..One day she gave me a tour of the HK facility. Old HK receivers rarely broke, but they ventured in car stereos, with high failures in late 80's..In the tech lab there were 2 techs, and 200 units piled up for repair..This location was the only US location for HK repair!

990 Bass issue: I went back and read a bulk of those bass management posts. Bottomline is if I have a standard 5.1 setup, my mains and rears set to small, and sub-yes..Crossover at 80Hz I should have no bass issues true?

990 Display Issue: As long as I run a standard composite RCA cable from the 990 to one of my TV video inputs, I get to see my 990 menu true?

990 Auto detect: I read in a post that the 990 auto detects incoming signal.. So once the 990 is properly dialed in by me, and the wife pops in a DVD she does not have to enter OSD, she turns on the 990 and adjust volume only...true?

I appreciate the comments about Outlaw as an organization. As Gonk states, they have been around 6-7 years selling quality gear...If the ice on the lake was only 1/4" thick over 7 years it would have broke through somewhere...

As for 990's lifespan, for me it would be 3-4 years...I'll wait for generation 2 HD-DVD, the dust settles, HD-DVD burners are out for the PC etc...

Thanks Vince

Yep. And there's also a firmware update in the works (no time frame yet for release, but from what we hear they're hammering away at it) to fix the cases where bass management misbehaves and to tweak some interface things people have asked about. If you've got a PC with a USB or RS-232 port, you'll be able to update the firmware when the update is released.

True. In fact, the 990's menu can be seen over any analog video monitor output (composite, s-video, or component), although the little "pop-up" (volume or input when making changes) only appears for composite or s-video sources.

Oh, definitely true - if it weren't, my wife would have banished the 990 long ago.