#58056 - 02/22/06 12:21 AM
autoEQ question
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Gunslinger
Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 102
Loc: WA
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Regarding Outlaw's addition of autoEQ to the 990, anyone know if this is still in the works or even a possibility at this point?
If so, will the eq logarithm be active in the time domain as well to reduce ringing or will it only flatten frequency response?
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Sony HS51 PJ
Outlaw 990 pre/pro
Outlaw 7100 amp
Denon DVD-2910
M&K LCR750
M&K Surround-55 tripole
Dual M&K VX-1250
Outlaw PCAs
Blue Jeans Component and HDMI
Panamax 5500
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#58058 - 02/23/06 11:50 AM
Re: autoEQ question
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Desperado
Registered: 01/23/02
Posts: 765
Loc: Monterey Park, CA
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IF the EQ system is anything like SNAP, then it probably doesn't measure in the time domain and do anything about ringing. Like most auto-EQ systems, SNAP attempts to flatten frequency repsonse. From the Sherwood site: An extension of the Automatic Speaker Setup routine that was added to these models late in 2004 as part of Newcastle's Field Upgrade program, SNAP first measures the frequency response of each of the 7.1 channels using sophisticated 1/12 octave amplitude mapping. According to Jeffrey Hipps, Sherwood's Sr. VP for Marketing and Product Planning, "1/12 octave measurements allow us to concentrate the highest accuracy on the frequency bands that can most benefit from equalization." For example, there are 24 measurement points in the bass area between 20 and 80 Hz. SNAP then uses up to 7 bands of parametric EQ per channel with both adjustable center frequency and "Q" to improve in-room system response. It's measuring how loud the bass is, which will vary from seat to seat, instead of measuring decay time, while will be more consistent across the room. Psychoacoustically, small improvements in decay time have a much more beneficial effect on the overall perception of sound than large improvements in frequency repsonse. Also, 1/12th octave is too coarse for measuring and correcting, especially when other room correction systems are down to .7 Hz precision.
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Sanjay
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#58059 - 02/25/06 01:41 PM
Re: autoEQ question
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Gunslinger
Registered: 01/19/06
Posts: 41
Loc: Corpus Christi, TX
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My P-965 comes in Monday. I'll have it hooked up some time next week and will let you guys know how well the SNAP EQ does or doesn't work. This feature, along with the better remote is why I chose the 965 over the 990, so I really hope it works.
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Zu Druid Mark IV, Zu center, Sonance TR-4000, SVS 20-39PCi, Sony DVP NS999ES, Arcam AVP-700, Outlaw model-7500.
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#58060 - 02/26/06 07:15 PM
Re: autoEQ question
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Gunslinger
Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 102
Loc: WA
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Originally posted by sdurani:
[QB] IF the EQ system is anything like SNAP, then it probably doesn't measure in the time domain and do anything about ringing. Like most auto-EQ systems, SNAP attempts to flatten frequency repsonse.
This is what I feared...darn!! If all it does is work to flatten frequency, it will be fairly useless in my book as ringing reduction is more important to me.
_________________________
Sony HS51 PJ
Outlaw 990 pre/pro
Outlaw 7100 amp
Denon DVD-2910
M&K LCR750
M&K Surround-55 tripole
Dual M&K VX-1250
Outlaw PCAs
Blue Jeans Component and HDMI
Panamax 5500
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#58061 - 02/27/06 12:56 PM
Re: autoEQ question
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Gunslinger
Registered: 01/19/06
Posts: 41
Loc: Corpus Christi, TX
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Originally posted by braidkid: Originally posted by sdurani:
[QB] IF the EQ system is anything like SNAP, then it probably doesn't measure in the time domain and do anything about ringing. Like most auto-EQ systems, SNAP attempts to flatten frequency repsonse.
I guess it depends on what you want it to do. In my set-up I've got a couple of peaks in the bass region I'm looking to tame. If takes these down and equalized my bass region,then I'll be happy. Got my processor today, so I'll know by tomorrow if the thing works or not.
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Zu Druid Mark IV, Zu center, Sonance TR-4000, SVS 20-39PCi, Sony DVP NS999ES, Arcam AVP-700, Outlaw model-7500.
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#58062 - 02/27/06 03:30 PM
Re: autoEQ question
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Gunslinger
Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 102
Loc: WA
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True, but ringing is just as important if not more so than simply a flat response. You may have a flat response, but if certain frequencies linger after they are played, you will still loose detail. For this reason, I'd rather have correct time to decay than a flat freq response. Until these processors employ correction in the time domain as well, they are simply a band aid to a problem.
_________________________
Sony HS51 PJ
Outlaw 990 pre/pro
Outlaw 7100 amp
Denon DVD-2910
M&K LCR750
M&K Surround-55 tripole
Dual M&K VX-1250
Outlaw PCAs
Blue Jeans Component and HDMI
Panamax 5500
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#58063 - 02/27/06 03:59 PM
Re: autoEQ question
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Desperado
Registered: 01/23/02
Posts: 765
Loc: Monterey Park, CA
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It's also difficult to use EQ for taming peaks because they vary from seat to seat. A frequency that rings between two walls will ring for every seat between those walls. So it's more productive to use EQ for decreasing decay time, because it will be beneficial over a larger area.
Personally, I would use EQ to address some of the ringing and use physical treatments for smoothening out frequency response. Their benefits will overlap at some point.
Still, I would be curious to hear Jack's results with SNAP. If it can provide any benefit, then that's better than none at all.
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Sanjay
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#58064 - 02/28/06 10:56 AM
Re: autoEQ question
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Gunslinger
Registered: 05/18/02
Posts: 203
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#58065 - 02/28/06 11:40 AM
Re: autoEQ question
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Gunslinger
Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 102
Loc: WA
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You know, I recently discovered this phenomenon as well. I had no idea eq could work in the time domain. You can read more about it here... http://www.lexicon.com/products/details.asp?ID=15 I believe Auydessy does something similar.
_________________________
Sony HS51 PJ
Outlaw 990 pre/pro
Outlaw 7100 amp
Denon DVD-2910
M&K LCR750
M&K Surround-55 tripole
Dual M&K VX-1250
Outlaw PCAs
Blue Jeans Component and HDMI
Panamax 5500
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