Hi all,

This week my Kenwood KC-X1 THX Ultra pre/proc died. Yeah, it was a pretty depressing moment as the unit has held up well for over 10 years.

Does give me the opportunity to finally move up to the digital surround formats and all the latest goodness.

After my experiences with the THX certification process (if they can make Kenwood stuff sound this good, they can make anything sound good), I'm pretty much stuck on getting an Ultra2 piece. Problem is, my KC-X1 originally sold for around $1200, but I paid like $600 for it while in the Air Force. Now there are no THX cert pre/procs for less than $2000 and the one item that is $2000 is the Integra DTC-9.4, which could use some more component ins Dolby IIx and HDMI switching. And of course, the price jumps up from there, although the Anthem AVM-30 can be had for the relatively paltry sum of $3000 (ha ha).

Anyhow, I'm intrigued by the 990, but wondering if I will miss all of the THX cert goodness (re-eq, decorelation, quality control and crossovers).

I've read some of the threads regarding comparisons of the 990 to the AVM-30 and the Arcam Ultra2 piece, but how does the 990 stack up to the higher end Onkyo or Integra receivers (used as receivers or as pre/procs) or to the Integra Research RDC-7.1?

In a perfect world, I'd buy the RDC-7.1, but as we all know, this world isn't perfect and I don't particularly want to spend over $3000 to replace a piece that cost me $600 10 years ago (inflation hasn't been that bad).

Plus the 30 day money back trial guarantee is really compelling.

So basically, I'm trying to choose between the 990, the Integra DTC-9.4 or the Integra DTR-10.5. As much as I'd like the Arcam Ultra2 piece of the Integra Research RDC-7.1 (which I'd actually prefer over the Arcam for its modularity and upgradability), they are just too much for my blood for probably not much gain.

Anyhow, any advice anyone can give would be much appreciated.

Oh, and before anyone starts arguing about whether or not THX certification makes a difference, they should read http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_13_1/feature-article-thx-1-2006-part-1.html

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I've never used a THX Ultra 2 processor or receiver for the reason you mention - cost. The cost premium tied to the Ultra 2 products that I might have considered in place of my Outlaw is significant, on the order of 2x or 3x or more. There would be some other benefits aside from THX, as one would expect from that sort of large jump in price, but for me the benefits offered by those more expensive alternatives weren't enough to justify the added cost.

Even lacking THX Ultra 2, the Model 990 is a very competent processor at a relatively friendly price ($1100 is still not peanuts, but compared to many of the alternatives it's a great value. I'd recommend giving it a try - the opinion in this case that matters most is yours, and the best way to make up your mind is to hear it. I think you may be pleased.

I'm with Gonk on this. You should take stock of your budget and do some listening and see if it matters to YOU. If it does matter, then you'll have to see if any relevant gear fits into your budget.

I personally think paying for the THX sticker is a waste of money. But that's just my opinion.

I'd agree about paying for a sticker as being a waste of money, but that's not what the THX program is about.

It's an end to end quality standard. Every piece that is THX certified has to meet the requirements of the program and as far as I know, it has to meet the manufacturer's published specs as well.

That's not to say that you can't meet or exceed the same quality standard without being in the program, but it sure keeps manufacturers honest.

Having said that, I do acknowledge that submitting pieces for certification is pretty much out of the question for smaller manufacturers like Outlaw, particularly when they are trying to keep costs down.

The standard, however, has made a difference in the home theater industry as companies now have a well designed set of goals to shoot for that aren't based on marketing crap.

At any rate, thanks for the feedback. Most likely I will give the 990 a try for a month and see how it performs.

Oh and my speakers are the Kenwood THX Ultra speaker package (3 LCRs, 2 dipoles and 1 passive sub) that Kenwood offered in 1995.

Excellent speakers in my opinion (particularly for what I paid for them, retail was $3000, I paid around $1500) for both movies and music.

Amplifier is the 6 channel x 100 watt Kenwood THX Ultra amp that was also part of their THX package at the time.

I believe that meeting the standard of quality required for THX is less of an issue today than it was a decade ago - companies like Outlaw, Rotel (whose RSP-1066, 1068, and 1098 lack the THX certification that Wayne's older RSP-985 offered), and numerous others have chosen to build hardware that offers very high build quality and performance without relying on THX to "check their work". It is this aspect of the THX issue that leads many people to write THX off as "just another sticker" - with a little research (a relatively straightforward task with the Internet available as a resource), consumers can find hardware that costs quite a bit less than comparable THX-certified gear and is reasonably comparable in build quality and performance. Credit must of course be given to THX for helping quantify some of the design goals incorporated into all worthwhile modern gear - it's just that you don't necessarily have to buy something with the THX logo on it to get a piece of equipment designed with those goals in mind. The one aspect of THX licensing that you still only get with the THX logo is their specialized surround processing (the software described in parts 2 and 4 of Brian Florian's THX article). As Wayne very accurately summarized, some of those features are also available outside the realm of THX (re-eq being the principal example), although some of course will be missing from the Model 990. Even without those, I still suspect that the Model 990 may prove a good fit for your system.

The THX standards can't be very daunting. My 5.1 computer speakers (Logitech Z-680) are THX certified and can take digital input and support decoding Dolby Digital and DTS. Anyone want to take a guess what sounds better when I compare it to my non-THX home theater system? *snicker*

By the way, the Logitech system is nice for non-audiophile types. The electronics are about the size of a brick, it's cheap, and even my Luddite parents can operate the controls. 8-)

Cheers,

That's another place where I think THX has tripped up - they've diluted the value associated with their name through THX-certified cables (which have sort of disappeared, thankfully), THX-certified computer speaker setups, some THX-certified DVD transfers that were criticized for disappointing video quality (although I haven't heard much about those sorts of slip-ups in recent years), and other marketing (mis-)adventures. Those who support THX are quick to point out that Logitech didn't get Ultra2 or even Select2 certification (I hope), but it still undermines the apparent benefits of higher-end THX certification.

No, the computer audio products are certified under the lesser THX Multimedia certification and while they are quite good for computer use, they aren't at all comparable to good home theater or 2 channel products.

The THX cable cert was there in early 90s, so has been around a while, but was only really wholeheartedly adopted by Monster Cable. Currently, Monster and Liberty Cable are the only companies with THX certified interconnect and speaker wire.

I personally don't see how the Multimedia cert undermines the higher end cert, but I think that it could be argued that Select certainly muddies the water.

The THX certification on the whole probably helps the large mainstream players like Onkyo, Yamaha, Pioneer, Denon and the like that are selling many more pieces than the smaller houses like Outlaw.

The main question being asked, really though, is if THX certification is a must have when shopping for a piece. To which, the answer is plainly no, or I wouldn't even be here in the first place.

It certainly is high on my list of features to look for, but if I can find same or better quality and features in a non-THX piece for less, then I certainly won't turn my nose up at it.

Anyhow, I'm still researching my options and trying to decide what to do, but will let you know what I ultimately decide. A lot of it rides on the kind of deal I might be able to get on an Onkyo or Integra piece. If I can get the Integra DTC-9.4 for less than the Outlaw, I will probably go with it, although I might give the Outlaw a try alongside for good measure.

Thanks again for the feedback.