Originally posted by braidkid:
Well, if you think about it....If you spent $2k more on a processor that sounds only slightly better than the Outlaw, you'd be pretty upset too and would stomp on the cheaper guy.
Outlaw has created an impressive name for themselves and the Anthems/Parasounds/Arcams should be worried.
Yet here you are stomping on 3 companies, and I'm willing to bet you've never seriously compared the AVM, Parasound, or P-9 (or P-8) to the 990.
To me its foolish ownership pride taken to an extreme level.
I own Arcam equipment, Martin Logan speakers, and an Outlaw sub. I even have some outlaw cables.
I have actually taken part in a blind test with people with a 990, P-8 (now replaced by the new P9), AVM30, and a NAD T163.
A Bel Canto amp was used (don't know why) and some really nice PSB speakers.
We had 9 people. All 9 people had a tough time discerning the AVM and the 990, as they almost tied, with the AVM just edging it by one person's opinion. This happened with both stereo music playback and both Dolby and DTS movie playback.
The NAD on the otherhand came in 2nd, and it wasn't by a whole lot, but it was more than "slightly," better, I'd say almost significantly. This was for music playback, and the NAD fell into the pack with movie playback.
So you could safely say that for Movie playback the NAD, Anthem, and Outlaw were pretty much dead even.
The Arcam on the otherhand won out without one person ever saying it wasn't the best on any part of the tests. The difference between the lot was significant. Movie playback sounded far more spatial. It was easily the biggest difference between two pieces I'd heard in years. Its why I bought an Arcam.
I would TOTALLY expect that from a Pre-Pro that costs nearly FIVE TIMES the Outlaw. I put some thought into the Outlaw and NAD, but the final decision came down to the fact that once I'd heard what the Arcam was capable of, I didn't want anything less. Call it 25% better, but 5 times the cost... and I judged the difference worth it. I just moved my budget around by getting said outlaw sub and some other changes.
We also did a Receiver test, and Arcam came in 1st and 2nd with their 2 receivers. Again without any form of competition except in the form of the Denon 3805 which competed well with the 250, but the 300 by Arcam won every test.
We did have an Outlaw, but it was the original Outlaw receiver, and it came in dead last, and I didn't think anything of it, and neither did anyone else. However out Outlaw guy insisted we see how it stood up.
What amuses me is that there are people who actually think that Outlaw is trying to get into the Arcam market. I seriously doubt that you could even find an Outlaw employee who would even say they are competition.
Outlaw is a very smart alternative to the NAD, Anthem, Pioneer, and Harmon Kardons of the world. However when I read an Outlaw owner pumping his chest trying to compare his product to the true high end (which I don't think Anthem is, Anthem Statement possibly) it disturbs me. It makes the Outlaw faithful look silly, when you have a lot to stand on.
Outlaw does a great job of competing with products that cost 50% more than their own price point and they are very good at showing what pieces are severely over priced (the AVM30 for instance). However there are still companies out there who do a standup job in the high end. Outlaw wasn't made to compete with them. Perhaps make it tougher to justify spending so much more, but not to compete.