It is of at least academic interest that the DAC's used in the Anthem AVM-20 and AVM-30 (AK4382) have the following specs: THD + N, 94 dB; Dynamic Range, 112 dB while the DAC's in the 990 (AD1852) have superior specs: THD + N, 104 dB; Dynamic Range, 114 dB.

Makes it hard to imagine how the Anthem could be audibly superior to the 990.

Dont post that in the AVS forum! You'll have a war on your hands!

Lets be fair.

You have to admit, that although the DACs have better specs, it is only a piece of the picture. There are a lot of other parts, pieces, and engineering surround that DAC.

I have to agree with chime-in. A good case in point is the Denon DVD-2900. In that model they used excellent DAC's but skimped on the actual analog output circuits. (I actually own that unit and had Dan Modwright work his magic, totally reworking the 2 ch outputs and the results were a marked improvement over the stock unit).

(BTW I'm not questioning outlaw quality-I have a 950 and my 990 is on the way)

Not hard to imagine at all. Maybe Anthem has a better implementation of the DACs; maybe Anthem has better analogue stages that follow the DACs; etc. Sound quality is a result of a combination of factors that run the length of the entire signal path, not the specs of one particular part.

Yes, everyone who has said that the specs on paper for the DACs is only part of the picture is correct. You can take a very expensive DAC with great specs and stick it in a poor PCB layout, in a system with noisy power supplies, and stick low quality components in the output filtering and end up with something that, as a system, has terrible measured performance and sounds awful. Circuit topology and board layout and type (i.e. 2 vs 4 layer) play a big part in the finished product.

My feeling is that Eastech (who does Outlaw's engineering, I believe) seems to design to reasonably good standards. I poked and peeked into the various 950's that I had early on in the process when it was introduced and thought they did a reasonable job. It was not over-designed as many boutique pieces are (which is sometimes cool, but not always necessary for performance).

Anthem had a reputation for providing a lot of quality and performance for the price - they clearly put a lot of engineering thought into the design of their products, both on features and on the nuts and bolts integration of the pieces. I would expect them to make sure that the overall design was solid. The fact that the 990 has DAC's with better specs is likely due in part to the fact that the basic chassis design (the P-965) and associated component selection is several years newer than the AVM-20 design (the AVM-30 is basically a tweaked and updated AVM-20, not a completely new product, which is why the two share so many specs). Before anyone thinks we're dismissing the difference in specs entirely, however, I will say that Lawrence's observation is certainly of interest, and it speaks well of the components (at least the DAC's) being used in the 990.

Eastech has done a lot for Outlaw in the past (both the 1050 and 950, and possibly the 1070), but the 990 is coming from Etronics. Etronics' reputation and Outlaw's past efforts to be picky about quality control would suggest that the end results are at least on par with what was provided by Eastech in the past.

I haven't posted here since the start of this thread, but I have to say that I was very interested to read about the methodical and fair manner in which jcmccorm conducted his testing. I look forward to hearing which unit he decides to keep. It sounds like a win-win for him.

Cary concluded his test and here are his results. Pretty good showing for Outlaw. Thanks again Cary for going through all the trouble to conduct a blind test. They are much harder than most would imagine.

Thanks Jed!

I still need/want to run through some DD/DTS stuff to see if one of these guys is "broke" or just clearly better than the other.

From what I've heard so far I can say this:

If you've got a 950 and don't have the funds to upgrade yet, don't sweat it, we're talking about a few % here of improvement.

If you're on the fence regarding the 950 and 990, I'd recommend the 990. I prefer it's sound to the 950 (at least in digital 2ch mode) and it's another great value from Outlaw.

Cary

As I am sure you all know BOSE stands for "Boldly Overpriced Sound Equipment". This has also been the true for every other manufacturer in the high end audio world (please forgive me for classifying BOSE as high end). That was until the Outlaws came to town.

Looks like Sheriff George wants to protect someones profit margin to me. As Big Dan said, "It's all about the money boys!"

We all know that quality electronic components are easy to mass produce these days at a very low cost, and with new advances in CAD, the design of electrical systems is easier than ever.

With all these advances along with the ability to sell direct to the consumer over the Internet (and cut out the profit of all those middle men), it is getting harder and harder to justify selling audio gear for the prices (and markup) that many companies have gotten used to.

For some folks (who have plenty of money and very little time), the value of boutique electronics that usually come with the services of local experts is well worth the extra money, but for the rest of us the entry of folks like Outlaw into the market is a real revolution.