I could not scroll through the available surround modes at Video 1. It sticks at PLIIX Movie. Have any one got this problem? Any suggestion to resolve this problem?

I can scroll different surround modes for DVD and other video inputs, just not the Video 1.

Kwok

That sounds a little odd. Maybe we can do some troubleshooting... What device is connected to Video1, and what is the incoming signal format?

Gonk: Tks for your quick response. I use video 1 for a DVD player that plays SACD and DVDA. Coax 2 and 5.1 analog direct connections are used.

So far, I am using the DVD, Video1, video 2 and CD Configs. I have no problem with the DVD and video 3 configs to change the initial setting of surr mod default (PLIIX MOVE) at the 990.

Any thought? Or Outlaw Scott can give me some direction?

Kwok

Gonk : I am using the Component 1 and S-video at the video 1. The Component 2 is open for nothing yet. The component DVD is used for another DVD player with S-video. I have a direct DVI connection btw this DVD player and the front projector.

Kwok

Gonk: I do hope I didn't confuse you. My projector has DVI, s-video and component connections with 2 DVD players and 1 LD player. That's why I have said connections.

Kwok

So video1 is mainly being used for SACD & DVD-A, both of which would actually be falling to the 7.1 Direct input (which is an independent input), but it also has component video and coaxial digital connected. What discs are you using in this player that are "sticking" in PLIIx Movie? Are they DVD-A and SACD discs only? If so, it may have something to do with the limitations on digital outputs of those formats - SACD's in my Yamaha don't produce any digital audio output, whereas DVD-A typically downmixes to DD 2.0 I believe.

Gonk: I am not talking about the auto detaction of the surround mode when playing a DVD movie.

I am referring to the "To select a default surround mode" at page 25 of the manual. The procedure just above LIP Sync Delay on same page. From that configuration screen, I could press < or > to scroll through all the surround modes in listed sequency at DVD, Video 2 configuation, but not the Video 1. I use the DVD player with COMPONENT out for casual (Junk movie) viewing. I use DVI direct from other DVD player for serious viewing.
Just don't know why I just cannot scroll the surround modes at video 1 only. The default mode is stucked at PLIIX MOVIE.

So you are in the video 1 input menu screen, with the audio input set to coaxial1, and the only option available for surround mode is Pro Logic IIx-Movie... If you put in a disc, can you select different modes with the Dolby and DTS buttons on the remote?

Gonk: Haven't tried yet. Will check and revert. Tks for your advice.
Kwok

I have a similar problem except it is on the dvd input configuration menu.Surround configuration is stuck at prologic movie iix,cannot scroll through.No problems scrolling on all the other video inputs.While playing a dvd though there is no problem in switching between different formats

If you experience a situation where you are unable to change the surround setting, you will need to have a signal present when attempting to make the mode change. This effects digital inputs only.

Ah-ha. That explains Kwok and pills' problem - source (DVD player in both cases) is set to a digital input, input is inactive (presumably device is off, or in Kwok's case has an SACD disc in it that does not offer a digital output), and so the 990 won't let the user manipulate the surround mode. Glad to get that puzzle sorted out...

Thank you guys. Happy writing and reading.

Regards.

Kwok

Thanks guys,problem solved.

I have another discovery. DTS 5.1 can only be changed to DTS Neo6 by the DTS Mode button on the main remode, when playing DTS 5.1 movie. I have to go to MAIN manual to change to DTS+ PLIIx Movie if required. Anybody encountered the same ?

The DTS button only offers options for DTS processing modes - which with a DTS 5.1 source means straight DTS and DTS+NEO6. Applying Pro Logic IIx to a DTS source is considered Dolby processing, and as such is only available by pressing the "Dolby Mode" button on the remote. (Interesting side note: unlike with older processors, the 990 will not let you apply DTS ES to DTS sources. This is because DTS issued instructions to manufacturers to only use NEO6 to generate surround back data from DTS 5.1 sources, since the processing used by DTS+NEO6 is exactly the same as the processing used by DTS ES Matrix with a DTS 5.1 source.)

Gonk: You are the best. The side note you pointed out is very interesting and I wonder how many people knew about it.
One thing that bother me about DTS Neo:6 Movie/music is for creating 6.1 channel sound from Stereo Movie or sound tracks. I wonder if the 990 picked up the stereo track from the movie instead of the DTS 5.1 track!?

Just a thought.

Kwok

NEO:6 serves two purposes - generating six-channel surround from stereo sources, and generating surround back data for DTS 5.1 sources (the role that folks previously equated with DTS ES's "Matrix" mode since it was a logical parallel to Dolby EX's ability to generate a surround back signal from regular DD 5.1 sources). I bet that you had the right track picked on the DVD player.

Gonk: If that is the case, should we stick to DTS NEO:6 instead of DTS+PLIIx? It seems to me we should use DTS NEO:6 on DTS Straight. What do you think?

Kwok

I think both are reasonable choices, and the best way to decide is to compare the two a few times and see if you have a personal preference. Why do I suggest this in spite of the fact that using NEO:6 would keep us solely in a DTS-licensed decoding environment? There are two things that cause me to leave the door open. First, both are being applied after the DTS decoding, so they are acting solely upon the left and right surround channels to generate the surround back information, so mixing DTS and Dolby by using PLIIx isn't quite as unappealing at it might initially seem. Second, PLIIx has an advantage over NEO:6 when it comes to generating a surround back signal, and that is that PLIIx generates discrete left and right surround back channels rather than the mono surround back produced by NEO:6 (and by Dolby EX, and many other similar matrix processing systems).

More surround modes.......leads to more choices, preferences, and after all a few headaches. Hee heeeeeeeeeee.

Kwok

I think we need a chart...

DTS Movie = options... 5.1,6.1,7.1
DTS EX Movie = options.. 5.1,6.1,7.1
DD Movie = options.. 5.1,6.1,7.1

I still get confused with this even after having a 1050 for quite some time.. I have sat there in silence wondering what did I do now..

Gonk and others:
Last night I tested the "Super speedway" dvd disc on DTS straight 5.1,DTS Neo:6 and then DTS + PLIIx, at -12dbs.
You know what, my preference priority is exactly the same listed above. Appears to me that DTS straight 5.1 produced the most distingtive sound separation and positioning and the bass was stronger and tighter. DTS Neo:6 came 2nd, as the sound was not as focused and the bass was weaken a bit. The DTS + PLIIx had the weakest bass among these 3 modes.
In my opinion, we would get the best sound quality and bass from the mode that the disc offers. Extra surround processing somehow would degrade the sound quality a bit. NEO:6 and PLIIx are meant for 2-channel source.

Kwok

The best I have found so far is straight DTS 5.1 using optical audio and split the L/R surround output myself fed to the surround and rear amps to give you psuedo 7.1.

You still get the excellent bass response that comes from optical DTS 5.1, and get spearation on left and right surround and rear channels.

There is a definate difference in quality, expectially the bass. Something gets lost in the processing of NEO and PLIIx

Is there a way to achieve this in software?

Trikos, I assume that you are using 2 Y-spliters to split feed both the side surround and the back surround.

Kwok said the same thing in another thread, and I'm not understanding why surround-back extraction seems to lessen the bass. The same bass content (from the LFE channel and filtered from other channels) is still being sent to the subwoofer, right?

Didn't the Sherwood have a similar bass problem with PLIIx? Anyone remember?

Hello Sanjay, Kwok,

I've tested this with several different pieces and am not getting a 12 dB loss. In fact, on one test, the levels were an exact match and on a second piece the additional 6/7th channel extraction led to a 1dB gain in sub output.

Scott

Based on what Scott says, I wonder if the difference you heard in levels was not actually a lessening of the bass output, but rather it seemed less as you had more noise around you. As you added rear channels and created a larger soundfield, perhaps the bass was "diluted" in the pool of noise?

Maybe not the best analogy, but I think my point is clear.

Kwok, yes I tried a Y cable.

I am still evaluating different modes, but there does seem to be a difference in surround modes. In some cases, a resonable one.

Keep in mind, I am sure this is not an Outlaw 990 only thing.

Obviously, the more "reprocessing" you have to do, the less clean the outcome. There is no such thing as getting extra from nothing (pseudo 7.1 from 5.1), there is always a cost..

What would be best is a world full of true 7.1 material in the first place..

Hi folks, Scott and Trikos,
I am sorry if my former message confused you guys. What I said was I set the volume to -12dB when testing those 3 surround modes, not bass loss of -12dB. Trikos, I do not use Y-cable.

If you guys have the DVD "Supper Speedway" in DTS 5.1, test those 3 surround modes (Straight DTS 5.1, DTS Neo:6 and then DTS + PLIIx), go to the chapter where the test driver passing through various passenger over passes across the run way before making a splint. Don't change the volume but just flip those 3 modes. You should hear the bass differences every time when the speed car passed under the cross overs.

Kwok

Scott,

Thanx for following up; your results are consistent with my experience with PLIIx. Wonder why others are getting different resluts.