yeah integra is better, but how many people DO YOU KNOW with integra? i know more people with Outlaw than integra and it has been around longer and is not internet only.

yeah, i know. i was just pointing out that integra is supposed to be onkyo's upscale line of produts. i don't know a single person that owns any integra hardware. i tried to demo an integra pre/pro and the dealer wouldn't let me demo one in my house. i told him that he'd lose a sale as a result and he didn't seem to mind so i walked...

later,
simp

Well, dang there goes the great marketing plan I was going to sell to Onkyo.

i have done some reading up on that card based receiver and it sounds pretty interesting. but i haven't been able to figure out what cards it comes with and if you can order it a la cart... plus where do you get the cards? might be a little ahead of it's time?

later,
simp

The 990 should have had an i.Link input. All of Yamaha, Pioneer, Onkyo/Integra, Denon, and Sony support it with various players and receivers (and pre/pros). Plus, Anthem is coming out with a hardware upgrade for their AVM-30 and D1 pre/pros to add i.Link, and B&K might as well.

Outlaw in the past has been very quick to include higher priced performance features in their very reasonably priced components as a way to undercut the competition (i.e., the analog BM the 950 has). They could have scored a real coup by including i.Link in a pre/pro this competitively priced.

Personally, I view the DVI switching that they did include as not very useful since the world has settled on HDMI anyway. My question: how much different would the 990 have cost if instead of DVI, they had included i.Link, which I view as much more value added...

i think that MANY more people value dvi switching over firewire. and IF the world has settled on hdmi, wouldnt firewire become obsolete anyway? if you were going to argue this case, you should argue for hdmi which will carry everything (hdmi now with upgradeablitity).

when that onkyo came out, i thought it was an excellent concept, but ahead of its time. i dont think it is too unrealistic to see audio gear sold like computers and able to be upgraded that way. the only reason why it might not happen is because consumers pay a huge premium for audio equipment now, and would probably end of paying a lot less if their products got modularized. all of these traditional audio companies wont want to cut their margins so drastically like the pc market has now.

i mean, if you think about what the sum of the parts in an audio product cost and its price, it is absurd. considering that most companies now a days do little engineering and mostly adapt what the chipmakers make to their specific needs, it is even worse of a rip off. there is basically no alternative though (outlaw being one...). then again, almost everyone has at least one computer in their house, while not nearly every person has an audio system. not many manufacturers want to go for quantity at low prices unless they have to.

DVI is disappearing. HDMI supercedes it. Look at the new players and displays coming out. 95% of them have HDMI, not DVI. But HDMI right now does not pass SACD/DSD. It might never. And even if it does, components with HDMI *today* probably will not be software upgradeable to accomplish that. Plus, HDMI cannot give a jitterless digital audio connection. i.Link can. And i.Link passes SACD/DSD now. I don't envy the Outlaw's decision concerning DVI vs HDMI vs i.Link. But I personally think they made a mistake choosing DVI.

at this point in time, i think that the choice of dvi over hdmi is probably the correct one -- especially if the 990s can be retrofitted with hdmi inputs (at least one) in place of the dvi inputs at the appropriate time.

but, i would have included an i.link input as well so that the 990 could more easily compete against the top-line units from other companies today.

Reading this thread led me to do a search.
Here's a link to a thread about hdmi problems:

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGLD,GGLD:2005-14,GGLD:en&q=hdmi+switch

Here's a link to a thread about hdmi vs. dvi:

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGLD,GGLD:2005-14,GGLD:en&q=hdmi+dvi

And in this second thread there's an article showing differences and giving explanations and some products with their specific connections:

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGLD,GGLD:2005-14,GGLD:en&q=hdmi+dvi

Does it not seem that when hdmi becomes fully stable dvi will vaporize like beta vs. vhs?
Now I'm concerned. I want the 990, but I don't wanna be sorry in the future due to incompatability. Gonk has addressed this issue thoroughly above.........but..........

Having retrieved this finromation:

http://www.hdmi.org/consumer/why_hdmi.asp

.....it appears that while HDMI is indeed the future (at least according to them) for me and perhaps most of us it's not a problem (gonk and others have alluded to this alread). The advantage to switching with HDMI as I see it is that everything gets switched at once. Since HDMI and DVI can talk and be compatible I have to ask myself if it's important that everything be switched at once....no.
So for me, I think I'm satisfied that the 990 with its DVI and without iLink (which would be nice but unnecessary) is the choice. Besides I'm at the bottom. Never really had home theater or anything like that.
Opinions invited.