Guys,

I'm in the market for a 50" tv and I thought I'd ask my fellow Outlaws for some recommendations. I've read many reports and comparisons on the various formats that it boggles the mind since each type has it's pros and cons. I'm looking for a format that will display the best picture in both standard TV and HDTV along with an exceptional DVD display. I would also like picture that looks 3D. It's hard to compare in stores since many are not set-up properly or the signal is split a million ways.

I currently own a standard 43" Sony rptv and the picture is quite good on DVD. I know I'm under-utilizing my Denon 2200 universal player with 3 Outlaw component cables since the TV is not HD and does not accept a progressive signal.

If you guys have any recommendations I would greatly appreciate your ideas. Thanks, Ron

Check this thread for a more general discussion of digital sets.

you are never going to get a 3d picture on todays tvs. accept that now and go for the best picture otherwise. you can get clarity and definition, but 3d is something entirely different. dont let the "minority report" fool you into thinking that technology exists yet, because it doesnt.

Thanks for your response. I went to another store this weekend and did some additional comparisons. I'm still not convinced that the overall picture quality of digital TV's is that much better than my standard format CRT Sony. The digital channels on my cable box are pretty good and so is my DVD picture. My biggest issue is that the back ground material on the digital TV's seem to shimmer which can be very distracting. If this is happening on HD material, what will it look like on standard TV or from a DVD source?

I also have concerns with replacing the light sources for the projection type TV. I've heard they need to be replaced aproximately every 3 years at a cost up to $300.

The CRT based HDTV's are probably the way to go, but since my table-top Sony is located on a low stand containing my stereo components, I can not use a 50" CRT HDTV due to the size and weight. Also the screens on CRT TV's still are very reflective especially during daylight hours.

I'm probably being too critical, but I always look deeply into every thing I buy. That's why I bought the Outlaw 950/7100 and LFM. Ron.

id agree that the best picture is on a crt (non-projection) hdtv. though you are limited by the size that you want. there is a reason people dont have 65 inch glass crt tvs, because it would weight a ton (figuratively and literally).

I have a Samsung DLP and I am having issues with the PQ. Samsung is actually replacing it so the customer service is pretty good. It may be just an isolated issue with this set but I have had some experience with 'ghost images' in my pic. Others who have this particular (HLPXX85-see my HT pics) have too so be careful and get the warranty .

Crt Rear projection sets can look excellent with ISF calibration and the price is right.I have a nice Toshiba 51" Cinema Series in the master bedroom.

To Nonrags:
I'm the newbie in 5.1/7.1
A comment, however on your presumption that projection light sources need replacing every 3 yrs. We've had our 50 inch Mitsubishi for 15yrs and even moved 1800 miles with it. No problems.
Didn't even require alignment or tweaking. I will admit I was amazed at that, though. But our sources seem the same as yrs ago. Maybe just lucky. Good luck. We'll be interested to know what you do.

DLP and LCD rear projectors do use lamps, and the average life is reported to be around three years. Older CRT rear projection sets (which are all that existed 15 years ago) use the CRT tube as the light source and the image generator, and as such do not require re-lamping.

I attended the Home Entertainment Show this weekend in NY and observed many tv set-ups from both the manufacturers and vendors. I thought by attending the show I would have observed these sets in the ideal condition using the best hardware and cables. The back ground picture still shimmered especially during action scenes on all the DLP, LCD and plasma sets. I thought the pioneer elite had one of the best pictures overall, but I can't justify spending 4x to 5x the price for a plasma over a rear projection crt. I decided to wait until the fall before I make the plunge. I'm leaning towards the 51" Sony or Hitachi rp crt.

Well I decided to take the plunge into hdtv and bought the Sony KDF55WF655 LCD rptv over the weekend. Even though I was leaning towards a rp crt, I didn't have the room to install one of those monster tvs. I needed a tv that would lay atop my equipment cabinet. I decided the lcd format over dlp due the moving parts of a dlp and the picture quality didn't seem much different in the stores. A good plasma tv was out of my price range in the 50 to 55" range.

Here's my first impressions:

-The picture quality in standard tv is definitely not as good as my 43" standard rptv, but I new that when I first looked into digital tvs. Some stations on cable looked awful while some were just ok. Even the best stations had some smearing of colors especially in darker scenes. I can't wait to hdtv on monday. I hope it as good as everyone states.

-The dvd picture is almost as good as the rp. I didn't notice any difference between 480i or 480p using the Denon 2200 univeral player even though I'm using outlaw component cables. I called denon and the tech stated that it is possible there may not be any difference especially due to the size of the tv and the format. He mentioned some customers actually thought 480i was better in some cases.

-I called Sony's tech support for some suggestions but the really weren't very helpful. I tried calibrating the settings using the video essentials dvd, but the picture seemed dull and dark.

If you guys have suggestions I will gladly appreciate any. I'll post this on the hometheater forum for their comments. I can't wait for monday and hope hdtv will restore my faith with this purchase.

Ron

What kind of 43 in. rear projection set do you have ?

Standard def. broadcast should look a little less detailed as the Sony is a very netural set . They tend not to be as friendly as crt displays when showing standard def. broadcast . I guess what I am trying to say is crap in crap out . If you feed it a bad signal it is going to reproduce all the inherit mistakes within that picture more accurately than your crt would . In a manner of speaking they actually work against themselves in this regard .
If you send an HD signal into the lcd I think you will be amazed by what you see .
Dvd's should look better on the lcd than on your rptv . However, I have noticed a trend with Sony 480i & 480p inputs . They tend to be not as clean as other brands . I wonder could this be a conspiracy by Sony to encourage the use of HDMI ? Because HDMI looks smokin on the sony lcd . Hmmm ? Just a thought .

You may want to upgrade to a dvd with HDMI 1080i, 720p output capability . Ask your dealer if he could demo the difference between component and HDMI for you . If he says no he is probably not a very good dealer .

About video essentials . It is only a guide for you not something etched into stone . Also are you sure that the type disc you used was optimized for an lcd display . They do have them but if it was an older disc it would be of little use to you . Again it is only a guide .
If you really want to see what the lcd can look like try having a pro. calibrate the set for you . It will run you $300 to $500 in coin though .

I will share this little tid bit after having gone through some of the earlier posts . The bulbs can run several hundered $ . My advice is to buy one now and have the other one ready for when it does go out . You would probably want to replace the original one in the tv with the new one right away so as to be sure it is not defective stock .

The length of bulb life is strongly reflected on how much television you watch a day . Also how bright you setup the display . The brighter the picture and hotter the contrast the less bulb life you will have . I have seen the inside of several Sony lcd's in for bulb replacement and have found that those who run their sets hot averaged about 6000 hours of bulb life . Those who dialed back the brightness got closer too 8000 hours bulb life . These numbers are again the average we have seen come though the shop according to internal counters .

Hope this helps .

Thanks for your reply. I'll look into the video essentials for lcd, but as you stated it's only a guide. I'll also look into getting an additional lamp and compare the output. By the way Sony sells the bulb for $200 on their website.

I can't wait to get hd on monday. I hoping your right, crap in crap out. Unfortunately my complex doesn't allow for satelite tv, so I'm limited to cablevision's signal. I'll post my findings after monday. Thanks, Ron

Ronrags, I do think you will be happy with the HD on the Sony . I have the chance to see HD every day on all the technologies ranging from LCD, DLP, HDILA, PLASMA, CRT, PROJECTION and LCOS . The LCD can stand on it's own with out any problems . Granted PLASMA and LCOS look awesome but were talking big coin there . Plus cable looks like cable on what ever it is displayed on including plasma and LCOS . The best display for cable is a direct view monitor (CRT) . Cable is what it is . There is not much you can do about that .

Look forward to reading your post on Mon. .

Here's my follow-up:

HDTV is great and I'm glad I made the plunge. The picture quality is amazing on this tv even from cable. The colors are so vivid and the picture is almost 3D. You were right that standard cable is what it is. But I was surprised to find the major networks (ABC,CBS, NBC) don't broadcast every show in HD, but PBS does. The non-hd shows on the hd stations are not much better than their equivalent standard stations. The baseball games on espn and inhd last night were fantantic. Even though I'm not an avid sports fan, the picture quality alone draws me to watching the games.

I watched several dvd's over the weekend and came to the conclusion that the lcd picture quality was around 95% the picture quality from my 43" sony rp crt. Not bad at all.

Concerning standard tv, I was able to adjust the picture quality for some stations to an acceptable level. I contacted Joe Kane's video essentials web-site concerning adjustments for lcd. The 2003 version dvd I purchased will work for the lcd format, but they are coming out with a manual on-line that will describe the adjustments in more detail. The file should be out this week and could be downloaded for free in pdf.

As far as the lamp is concerned, I purchased a 5 year extended warranty from pcrichards. The lamp will be replaced at no cost if it goes out during that period. Not bad considering I paid $400 for the warranty and the lamp costs $200 from Sony, the net will cost $200 for 5 years.

Finally, I'm glad I made the plunge after all my research and I highly recommend this sony tv which I paid only $2300. I did a lot research for buying the outlaw 950, 7100, lfm1, denon 2200 and KEF speakers and I'm very satisfied with all. Thanks for your comments. Ron

Ronrags, glad to hear you are pleased with your set again and I do apologize for not having got back too you sooner . I have been finalizing a deal on a house .

I figured that you would love HD on that set as it is awesome looking . As for the networks it is as usual all about the $$$$$$ . But PBS is a gov. backed network and it was the gov. that wanted to upgrade the broadcast standard too HD to begin with . It makes sense that they would support the effort fully .
Once more I am glad to hear your are finally having fun .