Brianca:

Very interesting article; thanks for the link. This all points up my main objection to the current 'bass management' thing - it's confusing as bloody hell to just about anybody, and when you factor in SACD and DVD-A, it's worse! I'd bet there are _very_ few people out there who can make sense of all this stuff: it doesn't pass the "my grandmother can do it" test!

He's quite right that when summing signals to be low passed, you do the summing first, then low pass the result. Phase anomilies result otherwise. That's one of the reaons I do it the way I do, (not using the LFE output of the processor: setting it to "no subwoofer"), avoiding the whole mess. I noticed that he described my setup exactly in the last sentence of the article, too. In an actual film dubbing stage, they don't use 'bass management'. The LFE is just sent directly to the sub woofer as a seperate channel. Setting the low pass on a subwoofer (in a conventional setup) really low, like to 40hZ is not really much of a liability in my opinion. Any 'hole' that results may not be audible as such. Things get pretty messy in the bass region below 100hz on any system, in any room, so differences might be swamped by such things as standing waves in the room etc. Short of using a real time analyzer and calibrated microphone, it's going to be a comprimise in any system. My recommendation, tune it by ear if that's the only option, and enjoy the show!

I _am_ taking it as an article of faith that when I set my surround crossovers in the 950 to 60hZ and the center to 150hZ that it does what I would expect it to do as I outlined in my original post. Now you've got me thinking. I'll have to measure exactly what's going on to confirm. Luckily, my surrounds and center are actually capable of running full range. In the 'mixing console' configuration of my system, they are in fact receiving a full range signal.

Thanks for bringing all this to my attention!

[This message has been edited by soundhound (edited October 11, 2002).]

4 years ago when only Theta processors had adjustable crossovers, I experimented with global xovers on other processors at 100Hz, 90Hz, and 80Hz and found they just didn't work well with my Dynaudio speakers in my room.

Therefore, in my processor's setup menu I set the Sub=No, Mains=large, center and surrounds=small on the processor and added an electronic xover (@60Hz) between my main towers (Dynaudio Contour 2.8) and my powered sub.

This essentially sends all bass from the small channels, plus LFE, to the main L&R channels.

This has allowed me to use the sub for both 2-channel music and HT. I hear those standup bass string plucks and HT explosions just the way I want without having to adjust the sub output constantly.

I also use a parametric EQ on the sub and sophisticated acoustic software to tune the room's bass.

The electronic xover has level controls for low-pass, high-pass, and xover frequency and uses 24dB slope Linkwitz-Riley symmetrical filters.

bstan:

Yep, your setup is pretty identical to mine, and you find exactly the benefits I've found - it is very 'set it and forget it' no matter what I shove at it. The only wrinkle in mine is that my subs aren't powered so I have an outboard amp, and I run stereo subs.

I really wish the industry went the external crossover route (or they could integrate it into the pre/pro) in the first place - it just seems so much more logical and beneficial, as least to my twisted brain.

[This message has been edited by soundhound (edited October 11, 2002).]

For anyone interested, I'm uploading a wav to my site ( this page ). It'll be another 60 minutes or so before it's done, but I'm off to dinner now. Haven't even had a chance to listen to it yet! Enjoy...

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gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

[This message has been edited by gonk (edited October 11, 2002).]

I just got back from dinner, and it's been up for a little over 10 minutes. Go get it!

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gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

Sure I have DL'd much larger than that. Make sure to get KaZaA Lite, so you don't have to deal with the Advertisements. You can get the KaZaA program at: KaZaALite

MeanGene:

It must be a PC program; I use a Macintosh. Guess that's what I get for 'thinking different'.

V

Are you sure about that?? I think I got about five pop-up advertisements as soon as I went to their website.

Here's what I got from the manual on the crossover settings:



So it says that the crossover settings set the high pass for the speaker groups, but not that it also sets the low pass for the signal sent to the sub. It doesn't say anything to imply that this isn't done either, so maybe the outlaws and step in here and clear it up.


brianca

[This message has been edited by brianca (edited October 12, 2002).]

[This message has been edited by brianca (edited October 12, 2002).]