I'll probably keep mine too (but not totally decided). As for resale value, I'd rather give a buyer the serial number if asked than have to tell them it's a "refurb". The average joe on E-bay probably will not be scholar on 950 history - but eveyone understands that refurbs deserve an extra discount.

The up-side? That's confusing. You would think if the noise floor improvement was as significant as people were reporting, that the new unit would sound clearly better than the old one. Though the reports also say that the sound difference is virtually nil.

My original reason for trading in was to see if the general harshness in 2 channel was improved upon. I hear that its not. So in that case, given my unit has hiss that's inaudible at normal distances, why trade in?

Market value? I'd rather sell a used unit that a used referb unit. Peace of mind? Heck the warranty's for 5 years anyway and at least I know mine came new from the factory without being opened and worked on manually by techs in the mean time.

Unless you have one of the "high hiss" models, I don't see any advantage in trading in for the refurb. But I'm willing to be convinced otherwise if there's something I haven't considered.


[This message has been edited by HT crazed (edited August 31, 2002).]

Guys,

i believe you are all forgetting something....

Remember when the 950's had the dropout issue? The Outlaws had to fix all these units that went out to us in the first batch so what i'm saying is that our units are most likely "factory modified" as well.

I don't think anyone so far (except for people in the second batch)has received a completly new, unmodified 950.

With a 5 year transferable warranty and so long as the 950 looks and function as new then i don't see what all the fuss is about.

AKA JGB (at work):

Bob - an apology to you as I agree my tone was not necessary (Friday/work/LA Holiday traffic just to get home/busy day). I will be deleting my ealier post to.

Also, I do remember your old posta at HTF re: how you were enjoying your unit. Like you, I really enjoy mine, and on occasion get testy when I read, what seem to me, topics that just don't fly.

As I cant acccess the HTF at work (filter sees it as art/culture and blocks out), I did not see any of your lastest posts over there.

I still think the "resale" concern on an $899 product is a non-issue, but if its important to you, who am I to take issuse with it. I'm a pack wrat, and hang onto everthing, including, my electronics. If I can ever afford a $5K+ investment in something, I'm sure I'd thik differently.

Most importantly, I apologize for my "go buy the Rotel comment", as 1) it was out of line, and 2) I for one hope a lot of people stick with their 950.

Only I'm not sure how to edit/delete my other comments.

You can't make it disappear entirely, but you can pick the button on the line at the top of the post (the line with the date on it) and change the contents of the post.

------------------
gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

JGB:

Thank you most sincerely for the apology. It was gracious and I appreciate it greatly. Let's shake hands and do some mutual deleting.

I just started an Outlaw Moment thread in the Demo section that I think might be a way for some of us to share the enjoyment we're getting from our Outlaw equipment.

Your stressor was LA traffic, mine is a seven-day virus that will NOT go away. I am literally full of ... uh ... too much information. Sorry.

The scene: A bridge over a gorge with mist rising up from below.
[gurgle]
GALAHAD:
There it is!
ARTHUR:
The Bridge of Definitive Music!

ROBIN: Oh, great. ARTHUR: Look! There's the old man from scene twenty-four. BEDEVERE: What is he doing here? ARTHUR: He is the keeper of the Bridge of Definitive Music. He asks each traveler five questions-- GALAHAD: Three questions. ARTHUR: Three questions. He who answers the five questions-- GALAHAD: Three questions. ARTHUR: Three questions may cross in safety.
ROBIN: What if you get a question wrong? ARTHUR: Then you are cast into the Gorge of Eternal Test Tones. ROBIN: Oh, I won't go. GALAHAD: Who's going to answer the questions? ARTHUR: Sir Robin! ROBIN: Yes? ARTHUR: Brave Sir Robin, you go. ROBIN: Hey! I've got a great idea. Why doesn't Lancelot go? LANCELOT: Yes. Let me go, my liege. I will take him single-handed. I shall make a feint to CES that s-- ARTHUR: No, no. No. Hang on! Hang on! Hang on! Just answer the five questions-- GALAHAD: Three questions. ARTHUR: Three questions as best you can, and we shall watch... and pray. LANCELOT: I understand, my liege. ARTHUR: Good luck, brave Sir Lancelot. God be with you.

BRIDGEKEEPER:
Stop! Who would cross the Bridge of Definitive Music must answer me these questions three, ere the other side he see.
LANCELOT:
Ask me the questions, Bridge Keeper. I am not afraid.
BRIDGEKEEPER:
What... is your name?
LANCELOT:
My name is 'Sir Lancelot of Camelot'.
BRIDGEKEEPER:
What... is your quest?
LANCELOT:
To seek Sonic Perfection.
BRIDGEKEEPER:
What... is your favorite movie?
LANCELOT:
LOTR.
BRIDGEKEEPER:
Right. Off you go.
LANCELOT:
Oh, thank you. Thank you very much.
ROBIN:
That's easy!

BRIDGEKEEPER:
Stop!
ROBIN:
Ask me the questions, Bridge Keeper. I am not afraid.
BRIDGEKEEPER:
What... is your name?
ROBIN:
'Sir Robin of Camelot'.
BRIDGEKEEPER:
What... is your quest?
ROBIN:
To seek Sonic Perfection.
BRIDGEKEEPER:
What... is your favorite surround format?
[pause]
ROBIN:
Uh, Dolby EX wait no well sometimes DTS-ESuuuuuuugh!

BRIDGEKEEPER:
Stop! What... is your name?
GALAHAD:
'Sir Galahad of Camelot'.
BRIDGEKEEPER:
What... is your quest?
GALAHAD:
I seek Sonic Perfection.
BRIDGEKEEPER:
What have you decided to buy today. Rotel or Outlaw?
GALAHAD:
Outlaw No, Rote-- eeeeeeeeel!

BRIDGEKEEPER:
Hee hee heh. Stop! What... is your name?
ARTHUR:
It is 'Arthur', King of the Britons.
BRIDGEKEEPER:
What... is your quest?
ARTHUR:
To seek Sonic Perfection.
BRIDGEKEEPER:
Does your 950 hiss or not hiss?
ARTHUR:
What do you mean? Did I never hear it? If I didn’t hear it and now I might hear it? If I might hear it in the foreseeable future?
BRIDGEKEEPER:
Huh? I-- I don't know that. Auuuuuuuugh!

BEDEVERE:
How do know so much about pre-pros?
ARTHUR:
Well, you have to know these things when you're a king, you know.
[suspenseful music]

Lena:

Excellent. That's all. Just ... excellent.

Now that's some funny stuff. Great post, Smart Little Lena.

So, who will be first to try to determine if their 950 has the hiss or not by checking to see if it weighs the same as a duck?...

------------------
gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

I see quite a few folks coming to the Outlaws defense over at HTF. Glad to see some good posts in response to the goofy complaints by those who like to bash Outlaw any time they get a chance. Like comparing the 950 hiss fix to supplying re-built engines in a new car- huh?? I checked my unit again today for audible hiss. Absolutely no hiss with a digital connection- it's dead silent. In analog bypass/6 channel bypass (which I use with my SACD player) I can hear noise at a -10 volume setting on my set-up at 1-2 feet. At +10 I can hear hiss at 12-13'. However, at -10 volume level,it will drive you from the room. Again, this is with analog sources only. I've decided to keep mine. I don't hear any noise (hiss), even at loud listening levels, when listening to music or other analog sources. I like the way my unit sounds and performs. So- I'm keeping it. Could it be better- maybe- but I don't use this thing at those volume levels, so I guess I just don't think it's worth switching it out. But, if you are not happy, it looks like the Outlaws will get you another unit to try. It doesn't get a whole lot better than that- does it?