Gonk and fellow Outlaws,

I have the 950 and I am curious if there is an easy way to audition multiple speakers with it (A/B switch type of thing). Is there a way to set up the 950 to quickly switch like that, or could you recommend a method for quickly testing speakers (some sort of radio shack type switching system)?

Thanks in advance for your suggestions!

Incog

Where are you planning to switch - 950 pre-amp output or after the amp? If it's at the 950's pre-amp output, you could use a Radio Shack a/v switcher like this one fairly easily, but if you are auditioning speakers it would make sense to keep the amp fixed as a constant. If you are comparing two pairs of speakers, you could use that switch and two pairs of channels in a multichannel amp (like the 755, 770, or 7100). If you are trying to switch downstream of the amp, a good switch will be a bit harder to come by. This one from Radio Shack might work, but I think it has spring clip connectors which may or may not work with your speaker cabling.

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gonk -- 950 Review | LFM-1 Review | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | Saloon Links

Sorry Gonk....I have the 7100 as well. I just want to switch between speaker cables really quick (turn one set of speakers off, and one on with the push of a button). I am just trying to figure out a way to do this quickly so that my ear doesn't forget what the others sounded like before I get the cables unconnected from the speaker and plugged into the next set.

If you can spare to use two channels of the 7100 for the second pair of speakers, the a/v switch box might be the easiest solution. Hook each pair of speakers to the 7100, connect the inputs for those channels of the 7100 to the outputs of the switch box, and then connect the left and right channel pre-amp outputs of the 950 to the inputs on the switch box. All it will cost you is a few extra sets of interconnects (which you might be able to cannibalize from elsewhere in the system if this is a temporary arrangement) and $15 for the switchbox.

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gonk -- 950 Review | LFM-1 Review | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | Saloon Links

Incognito:

It’s good that you are aware of the proper testing method.

With the second device mentioned by gonk, you can also test speaker cables too. I’ve heard about cases which the listeners who claimed to have good hearing couldn’t tell the difference between boutique speaker cables and cheap 12 gage copper cable from a hardware store. You can have lots of fun with that.

If this is temporary and you don't mind something 'gangly' looking, how about one Radio Shack #275-1537 for a one-to-one speaker comparison? Buy two for stereo comparisons, or you could buy several to compare a whole surround system. They're about $3 each. Just don't have them laying loosely around each other where conductors could make unintended contact. Also, while the 7100 could probably handle load-open-load switching, I'd recommend going to mute while you throw the switch(es). There are some other switches with better asthetics, just do a "switch" search at the RS website. I'm sure you'll be careful with the wiring - no shorts, right?

[This message has been edited by bestbang4thebuck (edited October 04, 2004).]

Hey all...

Thanks for all of comments and suggestions. This is purely temporary, for comparison of some speakers I have ordered. I am sold on the internet direct home theather purchasing now. I have 30 days to demo two sets of speakers, and get one set back in the mail. I posted in another forum for people's comments on the two sets of speakers, to help with my comparison. I have the Axiom M80's and I just ordered the Onix Rocket 750's. If anyone has any puts into those speakers, they are welcome also.

My only question is that these two speakers are driven at different impedences (Axiom = 4 ohms and Rockets = 6 ohms). Will this in any way harm these cheaper RS switches, or the amp for that matter?

Thanks again guys!!!

I have one of THESE that I use for the purpose you describe and it works especially nice because each channels volume can be set different to account for different speaker efficiencies. It would be pricey for just comparison usage so I doubt it will be an option but it does work nice.

Most of the switches are rated for several amps, but you won’t be switching during a high signal state, right?

In any case, if you’re not going to use a volume equalizing switch, you’re going to have to determine at which volume setting of the preamp does each brand of speaker produce the same sound level, say a -16db setting for ‘brand A’ and a -18db setting for ‘brand B’ to read the same acoustic level on a meter. As you go between listening to one brand and the other, you’ll need to stop the signal, change the switch(es), and set the volume to the appropriate level before resuming the comparison signal.

Do what you can to make the comparison fair, but don’t sweat too much. Even in a laboratory setting, it’s hard to set up ’scientifically’ valid A/B comparisons. At the end of the day, isn't what you're really after an answer to the question, 'which brand of speakers are my preference overall?'

So, when setting the db for each speaker in this test, should it be done with white or pink noise?

Also, not to go to far off topic, what is the difference between white and pink noise (besides the sound)? Is one better for calibration?

Cheers,
Nert

From http://www.firstpr.com.au/dsp/pink-noise/ . . .

For the purposes of this discussion, "power" means the average power or energy contained in a signal over a long period of time.

White noise has the same distribution of power for all frequencies, so there is the same amount of power between 0 and 500 Hz, 500 and 1,000 Hz or 20,000 and 20,500 Hz.

Pink noise has the same distribution of power for each octave, so the power between 0.5 Hz and 1 Hz is the same as between 5,000 Hz and 10,000 Hz.

Since power is proportional to amplitude squared, the energy per Hz will decline at higher frequencies at the rate of about -3dB per octave. To be absolutely precise, the rolloff should be -10dB/decade, which is about 3.0102999 dB/octave.

The distribution of energy in pink noise resembles the distribution of energy in acoustic instruments and voice. The distribution of energy in white noise reproduction asks a high frequency driver to handle a power level similar to that of mid and low frequency drivers – not a good thing unless you keep the overall level low. Either white or pink noise can be used, but pink is going to give a closer approximation of real-world use.

You can find more information on the web using your favorite search engine.


[This message has been edited by bestbang4thebuck (edited October 07, 2004).]

Thanks bestbang4thebuck,

Sometimes I forget about actual search engines on the internet.

From what I gather reading from the post that you gave, plus a couple of other websites, pink noise tends to be better for calibrating speaker db levels - which seems kind of odd because from what I remember, both AVIA and Digital Essentials each use white noise to help a person calibrate.

Incognito, I gather from your remark under another topic that the Onix Rockets got your vote. Do you have any remarks on the process and the results of your comparison that you would like to share?

Sorry for not posting a huge review...but I made some comments, as well as my friend Nert, in another thread. I apologize if this isn't the way to link between threads, but it's in here:

http://ubb.outlawaudio.com/cgi-local/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=6;t=000502

If that didn't work, it's under "Outlaw to Outlaw" and the threat "New speakers for my...combo" (or something like that). As I give these more of a listen, I will try to report any new thoughts or problems that occur. Most recently I am having problems getting the image right with them (diagnosed that it's probably due to my inperfect positioning, or a reflection somewhere). It's about there. I can best sum them up as warm, detailed (some say they have a roll off...I call it non-bright), and the sound stage is awesome! Now, I use to have old Definitive speakers, and I compared them to the Axiom M80's that had more detail than the Rockets. But, the cost was my ear drum. I love these speakers thus far. Combined with my Outlaw equipment...I'm one happy camper! I need a line conditioner, maybe a larger amp (using 7100 right now), and a big screen TV and I'm set.

If you have any questions in particular that you would like me to try to answer, I can do my best. I'm not as knowledgable as most on this board when it comes to inner workings of audio/video equipment. I only know what my eyes and ears tell me.

Guess I wasn't lookin' in the right places. Thanks for pointing me to your comments. We all have to live with our eyes and ears - in the end, that's what counts in our enjoyment!

Sorry. I probably put it in the wrong spot. That was the location where my bud Nert signed me up for a review. He's a great guy other than that.

I would be happy to try to give an explaination of them. It wasn't an easy comparison. The Axioms have a level of detail that I hadn't ever heard before. But, they can be so bright that it makes you flinch when a high note is reached. I have given that some thought though, and the M80's are for large rooms (mine was on the low end of their recommendation). The M60's they offer might be a very good speaker. I find it hard to believe that I would prefer them over the Rockets though. I am really liking the warmer feel of these speakers. And, you honestly don't lose much, if any, detail. They seem to blend together (what I call sound stage) better than the Axioms. That was pretty important to me. It really makes the music (haven't done enough testing with movies yet) come alive.

My buddy Nert has Paradigm and he says that they are between the Rockets and Axioms...so if you have the money...they could be a better choice. Given how happy I am with my Outlaw products...I started looking for Internet Direct manufacturers only, and found a few. I liked the two above, and gave them a listen. I hope that my comments on the two help if you are considering the same thing.

Sorry again for leading you all over the forums.

Incog

The Axiom's tweeters might need a bit of break-in time to help tone down the harshness, but even after such a break-in I can't see the difference affecting your overall conclusions. Like bb4b says - it's our own eyes and ears that count the most, and it sounds like the Rockets (which from all I've heard about them are great speakers) are just what you were looking for. From what you and Inertia4u have posted, it sounds like the testing was a great success.

Truthfully, I think anyone that is thinking of upgrading aught to listen to both...but especially the Rockets. I'm a little partial now...but they are quite nice. It's warm, yet detailed...and the louder you turn it up...the larger the sound stage gets, without becoming overwhelming. It's quite impressive.

Happy Listening all!