I'm a complete home theater newbie but want to get into it. I have around $2000 max to spend. Currently, I have a great Sony 32" tv (HDTV ready), Directv (with only composite outputs from the box), Adelphia cable (for local stations) and a decent VCR. I'm considering the 1050, a Denon DVD 1600, and Home Theater Direct Level 3 speakers (the complete 5.1 set). My priorities are watching sports and movies on satellite and cable tv, watching DVDs, and listening to CDs and eventually DVD-Audios. This is in a typical family room.

It all looks like it will work, to me, but I really don't know what I am doing, to be honest. I would greatly appreciate any advice that people can give me on any aspect of this plan (everything from having enough inputs on the 1050 to my choice of speakers). I should add that I am considering the Denon AVR 1802 instead of the 1050. Thanks!

It sounds like a good plan to me. The HTD Level 3 speakers have been used by others with the 1050, as I recall.

Inputs should be fine. I'd run composite video from the DirecTV, Cable box (if you have one), VCR, and DVD, which will use up all four composite video inputs. If you have cable TV run straight to the TV, you could connect the TV's audio output to the AUX audio input. I'd also run component video directly from the DVD player to the TV (the composite from the DVD is largely for convenience). You've got three digital inputs, but only one source with a digital output, so you should be in fine shape there.

The Denon AVR1802 is also a pretty good receiver choice, from what I can tell (haven't used one, but I haven't heard any negative reports anywhere and it has a 4.52 rating at AudioReview). On the plus side, it offers Dolby Pro Logic II, which can be nice for TV watching (cable and satellite). It has a phono input, which the 1050 does not (which could make a difference if you had a turntable and didn't want to use a separate phono preamp). It also has more S-video inputs (which you won't be using currently, and may never use). On the other hand, the remote for the 1802 isn't as nice as the 1050's. The 1802 does not have full preamp outputs, only mains, center, and sub.

The 1050 offers the "Surround 6.1" feature (not available on the 1802) for a surround back channel on Dolby Digital 5.1 soundtracks, but a lot of people never use it -- they get a 5.1 set of speakers and either can't find a place for a surround back or don't have the budget left for the extra speaker.

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gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

I very much appreciate your input, gonk. I've been reading the forums here and have really found your postings to be informative and educational, so I value your opinion! Thanks very much for the reply.

As I will probably be in a 5.1 setup for the foreseeable future, the Pro Logic II might be the deciding factor for me. It sounds like this is a useful thing for improving the experience of videos, CDs and regular tv. We will be listening to a lot of CDs and a watching a lot of regular tv (mostly sports). I wonder why the 1050 doesn't include this feature?

I really like everything I hear about the 1050. So, the question becomes, do I need Pro Logic II? If so, I may step up to the Denon AVR-2802 (I had ben considering the 1802). Does anyone else have any input? Thanks!

[This message has been edited by dragpeace (edited August 01, 2002).]

The 1050 lacks Pro Logic II because PL2 didn't come out until after the 1050 was in production, and unfortunately it appears that Outlaw can't add it without a significant redesign.

There's been a lot of talk around here about the merit of Pro Logic II -- a lot of people in the same boat that you are in now, considering the 1050 but wondering about whether to get PL2 since it is now available on a number of receivers. The typical answer, of course, is "it depends": how much TV watching do you do, and how much of that is TV that may benefit from PL2? I've used PL2 on my 950, and there are some programs where it's not much use. If the stereo track is not much more than mono to two speakers (or if it's not stereo at all), PL2 is not going to be able to do much for you. Local news and CNN aren't going to give PL2 much to work with, for example. Movies on satellite may be a good candidate for PL2, on the other hand. If it were me, I'd also have to look long and hard at the 1802's remote and the absence of complete pre-amp outputs (particularly the latter), but if you don't think you'll want to add an amp later and aren't looking for a universal remote those wouldn't be as much of a factor.

There are others around here who will probably jump in shortly and offer some first-hand experience in making this very decision, too.

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gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

dragpeace:

I had a 1050. It is very nice, especially for the price. Set up and ease of use is good, especially for a first time HT user. DVD (5.1 & 6.1) is great. But because I use my system for TV, Dish, VHS quite a bit (and music) - my only reservation was the lack of PLII. After giving another brand with PLII a test run (a demo model they let me take home), I opted for the other brand. It was the correct move for me. I do like PLII over PLI - though I ended up jumping into a slightly higher dollar bracket to get the model with "Circle Surround", which I find to be superior to PLI or PLII. The 1050's PLI is quite good though, and you'll find it very tough to match the 1050's power in that price bracket - for sure. Also, dealing with Outlaw, and corresponding with The Outlaws in this forum is a bonus. So, I recommend doing what I did - take the advice of other Outlaws in this forum - do your research, and try to compare receivers at home in your own environment. The receiver is the engine of your system. Whatever you buy has to please you and your needs, and no one else. Good luck.

md

Gonk, thanks for all your excellent posts. You've been very helpful to many in this forum, including me. I agree with your assesment of both PLI and PLII. To add to my "just-posted-post", I looked at the 1802. I have to say, to me, the overall sound and quality of the 1802 cannot compare to the 1050 - PLII or no PLII.

Mayor D,

You had me almost convinced to skip the 1050 (and go with the 1802 or 2802) until you said:



Sound quality is what I care about most. We'll be watching a lot of regular tv (both cable local channels and via Directv) but also listening to a lot of CDs (and more and more Audio DVDs) and a lot of DVD movies. Sound quality is critical to me (and I do read a lot about how PLII has "put new life into the sound of old movies", etc.). Your quote puts me back in the very undecided column again. May I ask what receiver you ended up going with?

Thanks!

[This message has been edited by dragpeace (edited August 01, 2002).]

dragpeace:

The reason I said what I did about the 1802 is because to me, the Denon product sounded a bit thin and top end, and the 1802 is only 5.1 (I wanted 6.1). I listened to a 2802 also, I felt the same way. I ended up with a Marantz SR7200, but it did cost me approx $120 more than the 1050. I made the jump to the SR7200 to get more power, Circle Surround, an excellent learning remote, and a couple other more updated features. So I'm very happy with my choice, but I did pay extra to get it. The only reason I returned my 1050 was because PLI wasn't quite giving me the surround sound I wanted, and the other product did (plus other features), though I paid more. We watch a lot of DirecTV and VHS, so the SR7200 works for us. For my purposes, I think if the 1050 had PLII I would have kept it. I feel guilty saying all this because Outlaw is a great company with great product, and the other Outlaws in this forum have been so helpful. But I do anticipate owning an Outlaw product of some kind one day. So - For DVD, the 1050 is great and powerful. For two channel stereo music, it is very good. For TV, DirecTV, VHS, and music played in 5.1, I prefer what I have. So again, in it's price range, I don't think a receiver can beat it. But truly, try to do a comparison on your own to hear what you think of the difference between PLI and PLII, and maybe another surround type feature. Try to think what is best for you long term. I hope this helps.

md

[This message has been edited by Mayor D (edited August 02, 2002).]

Sorry Mayor D. I started typing before I read your whole post. I think we're pretty much saying the same thing.
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but it's my assumption (I know I shouldn't but I am) that PLII will only enhance Pro Logic encoded material. That means some TV and the better part of pre-recorded VHS tapes. If you're going to be watching your movies mostly from DVD, PLII isn't going to do much for you.

By and large, most DVD's will have a Dolby Digital or DTS soundtrack or both. So, if what I'm reading from your post is correct, you won't really have a huge use for PLII since most of the source you listen to will either be DVD or CD.

Maybe I just don't know what I'm missing with the PLII, but I couldn't be happier with my 1050.

[This message has been edited by kugumby (edited August 05, 2002).]

I use PLII, in Music mode, quite frequently with CD material and with FM radio and find it to be quite enjoyable for certain music types. Also, PLII cinema is quite nice for a lot of the video games I play. It does some simply incredible things for Final Fantasy X.

So... it's not just for old VHS tapas, and it's not just for PL encoded material (although it is at an advantage when the source is PL encoded).

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Matthew J. Hill
matt@idsi.net

Kugumby:

Right - For DVD, PLI or PLII is not needed. For music CDs, Satellite, TV, VHS - that's when PLII comes into play. I agree with Matthew Hill, it does sound very nice.

Right now DVDs make up 20% of my viewing/listening. So 80% of the time, I use PLII and Circle Surround.

If your system is used for DVDs the majority of the time, then the Prologic issue is not a big deal.

PLII is the only reason I opted for a brand other than the 1050. Other than that, the 1050 is great! I still feel guilty - but there will be another Outlaw purchase opportunity in the future.

Mayor D.

Thanks Matthew and Mayor D. I had wondered what the fuss was all about when PLII came out but I already had my 1050 and really didn't research it any further.

Now I know there's more to it than meets the eye. (Or the ear as it were.)