After a ton of research I am about ready to upgrade my preamp and the 950 certainly seems like too good a deal not to at least try. My question, is the On Screen Display active through the component inputs. All my video both DVD, and cable with High Def all output through component video. Any information would be greatly appreciated.

OSD is not available on component output. This is actually pretty common -- aside from a small number of pre/pros that will upconvert composite and s-video to component, most pre/pros do not provide an OSD on the component output. Adding OSD to the component signal is very processor intensive and can very easily yield a degradation in video signal (which is why it's so rare). The 950's OSD is useful, but it is not essential because the front display is capable of providing all of the information necessary for operating the 950 (including setup).

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gonk -- 950 Review | LFM-1 Review | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | Saloon Links

Thanks, That's kind of what I've been running into, My problem is that since I've switched to front projection my screen covers my components, and making adjustments without visual confirmation is a hit or miss process at times. I would love to be able to just monitor where the volume level is.

Don't know about the rest of your configuration (and I don't have a 950)but my Pioneer HDTV cable decoder box has a baseband input and does upconversion. If you have a unit with similar capabilities in your system, you might be able to approach this that way.

or you could get a processor with upconversion.

Thanks for all the feedback. I am using a Motorola DCT5100 digital cable box that has high def built in and it works great.It also uocinverts all cable to a 480 progressive signal so depending on the original programing some look great some not so great.My preamp is a Marantz AV560 (early adoptors always pay a price ) so right now I don't even have component switching, I have to use an external switch to change between DVD and cable. I have started reading about some of the newer processors and recievers that have video upconversion and OSD through the component outputs, I really don't want to go back to a reciever and I think the most affordable preamp to offer this is the new Rotel 1068 as well as the 1098. I might have to be patient a little longer and just wait for this technology to become more common place.Does anyone know of other processor that offer this and/or how long before Outlaw revamps the 950??

I actually just got finished revamping my pre/pro comparison chart , since it was getting a bit outdated. There are four pre/pros on the chart that offer upconverting: Rotel 1068, Rotel 1098, Sherwood 965, and Integra DTC-9.4. The Sherwood 965 and Rotel 1068 retail for about $1500-$1700, the Integra for $2000, and the Rotel 1098 for $3000.

There is no official word about a new Outlaw pre/pro. If I had to guess, I would say that there won't be one until some time in mid to late 2005.

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gonk -- 950 Review | LFM-1 Review | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | Saloon Links

It could take quite a bit of patience waiting on a new Outlaw processor to be released. Then again, Outlaw usually makes some announcements in May and June, so there may be more information soon.

Correct me if I am wrong, but in round numbers, aren’t the Rotel processors between two and four times the cost of the 950? Secondly, is your need for up-conversion for the OSD only, because the sources are already component and will just be passed through? Or will you also be up-converting some sources that are not available as component?

There are some other features that the Rotels have that the 950 does not, I would just make sure I needed them before spending quite a bit more.

If the OSD is really the make-or-break issue, and the 950 suits your needs in every other way, are there any creative ways of seeing the 950’s front display or OSD that would cost less than $1K?

Just my way of thinkin’

this may not suit you, but what i just did was get a denon avr3805 that i am gonna use as a pre/pro only (except for other zones at least). it has upconversion to component is why i bring it up. it also has a ton of features that i liked, is good quality being a denon, and was in my price range of right at $1k. i was gonna do a pure pre/pro with my amps, but i honestly didn't see any advantages in the available models that had similar specs. the 3805 has a parametric eq which is pretty cool, i dont think any pre/pro has that in its price range, differential dacs, decent remote, triggers, remote outs, etc. I haven't had it long enough to fully comment, but without having set it up taking my time (girlfriend forced me into hooking it up for a movie...), it is way better than my old unit.

Great point bestbang4thebuck, before I started I made a list of everything I wanted in a preamp and yes the 950 fulfills everyone one except the OSD from component. I must admit spending two to three times as much solely for OSD is a bit foolish. There has to be a way to rearrange my components for visual confirmation of adjustments although I do like the fact that with the screen down all you see is the movie, no clocks no displays. Maybe it's time to make that audio closet on the side of my room.

Interesting solution, curegeorg. Once you’ve lived with the 3805 for a while, I’d be interested to know your likes and dislikes of it as a pre/pro. Compared with some of the features on the 3805, it does seem that the current 950 is showing its age. I’m not about to run out and replace my 950 tomorrow, but if the features on the 3805 draw enough consumer interest, perhaps Outlaw will include similar features on the next Outlaw pre/pro.

I'm curious, shawnb16: if deploying your screen means no equipment is visible, are you still able to control your equipment with remotes that rely on non-visible light transmission?

I seem to remember some gunslingers that connected an otherwise unused monitor to the composite output of the 950 for OSD viewing. A part of me might even like that better. Too often it seems that when I make a volume or other 950 adjustment, I’ve done so at just the wrong time to have an OSD pop up and hide some detail of what’s on screen. So my thought is: the main viewing area has no OSD; at the side or below, I set up a small monitor with the contrast and brightness set low enough to make the screen virtually black and not distracting in subdued lighting. When I actually change some parameter on the 950, then I could see the menu wherever I wanted to have the monitor placed. I suppose for this I wouldn’t want an old CRT monitor on and soaking up the watts – perhaps the most inexpensive, flat, low-wattage LCD direct-view monitor I can find? I could also have POOP instead of PIP if I wanted, depending on what was routed via the composite side while the component was being used for the main screen. (Picture-Outside-Of-Picture … who’s laughing?) Then again, POOP might be a distraction if it was visible while trying to watch the main screen.

OK - Shutting up now, sir.


[This message has been edited by bestbang4thebuck (edited April 29, 2004).]

One option (which won't help any for seeing the volume or format change while watching a movie) is to run a composite or s-video cable from the 950 to the projector, thereby getting you access to the OSD when desired. Cheaper than stepping up to a Rotel 1068.

Also, one of the 950's beta testers (RAF) set up his equipment racks with the pre/pro (originally a Denon receiver, then a 950, and I believe he's now using a Lexicon MC-8) on the bottom shelf, so that it peeked out just below the screen. It allowed the screen to cover all of the other equipment (including his TV set) while still giving him access to the front panel display. It may not work for your equipment rack, though.

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gonk -- 950 Review | LFM-1 Review | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | Saloon Links

While I understand that a external switch for switching between DVD and cable is inconvenient, I would caution you to do a lot of testing and not assume that any receiver or audio pre-pro will do a better job of upconverting a non-HDTV signal than your existing cable box. From what I have read and tested on my own system, most of these devices can be somewhat lacking in terms of conversion modes and/or not provide all of the component bandwith that you. You may want to save money on the audio pre-pro and look for a video processor especially with a front projector unit. I would check the Sound and Vision forum and do some research there.

I like the alternate monitor idea alot. I am able to control my components behind the screen with an IR remote setup I put together when I was planning the front projection system.
My screen comes down to with in 18" of the floor so keeping the preamp low isn't a possible solution.
To clarify one point, the video conversion isn't a desire of mine since I already have that capability, what I need is component switching. The conversion just came about because the only preamps that offer OSD through component outputs are those with video conversion.
I do have room to move the preamp outside of what the screen covers, this might look a little odd when the screen is up but it would slove the problem of being able to see the adjustments I'm making. Does the 950 have a dimming feature for it's display??
Thanks to all for all of your input, it is greatly appreciated.

Although perhaps tedious, there is a lot of information available in the 950 online manual.

http://pdf2.outlawaudio.com/950manual.pdf

As far as component goes, the 950 has two in, one out. The web specs say 45MHz as the upper usable limit. Perhaps this is for standard component, but not HD?

The 950 display shows either full or half brightness. I have not found half brightness to be distracting about 2 feet from my screen, but readable if I look right at it.

i have a setting on the 3805 which allows me to choose what is shown on the osd, i.e. not volume during the middle of an intense scene of a movie, but setup features, etc. interestingly enough i don't use it for video upconversion (or switching at all) though, seeing as my tv has enough jacks at the moment for what i have. in the future i am sure it will come in handy though, and is wide banded enough for hdtv, hd-dvd. i will re-post when i get some more time vested into experiencing it, so far so good (although i haven't even begun to configure the remote, which i'm sure will suck).

Hey curegeorg,
I was wondering how the Denon AVR3805 set up as a preamp was working for you? I have thought about using one of the newer recievers as a preamp but just cant find enough info or feedback from anyone doing so.

great so far. i dont have any complaints. i am planning on writing a mini review, once i take the time to evaluate it more than just being great. sound quality is very good, especially in pure direct mode for cds. i havent seen any issue/quirk while using it. the remote is nice, not the best you could ever get, but better than a lot. the 3805 is how i expected it to be. if you have any specific questions let me know.