I bought Paradigm's surrounds, and as suggested in the Paradigm product manual, have set up my 5.1 system with the surrounds in the rear corners because of pathological room geometry. (really, really not fixable, trust me). (The fronts and center are Paradigm too, the sub a downfiring Hsu.)

However, I don't quite think things are right. The speakers sound fine on individual level tests and meter in balance with the other speakers at at 75dB and 85dB(Avia guide to home theatre, and the THX tests that come with "Finding Nemo"). However, the results with movies aren't quite right. Even when listening I have trouble picking out the surrounds. I did program the distance right in the configuration, but was wondering whether the back diagonal placement might need some other compensation because the speakers are not to the left and right of the listening position.

Suggestions for the clueless are most welcome.

Ya know, Clueless, I had the same experience having set the 5 speakers using the Avia and a RS meter. When I use the system I find that I crank up those rear speakers, too. Did you remember to turn off your sub while balancing the other five? Output from the sub can alter your results.

Jay

Have you tried calibrating your levels using the 950's internal test tones? I'd be curious to see if that produced a different result for the surround levels.

The sound meter is a great tool, but you should not be afraid to tweak by ear a bit if things seem off after you are done. Like Jay, you may try just bumping both surrounds up 1 to 3 dB and see what happens.

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gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

Yes, try increasing the level of the surrounds a little bit. A db or 2 should do it. But... I think that in an ideal system, you actually shouldn't be able to hear the surrounds that much, *except for discrete effects* like gunshots, flybys, etc. For ambient type effects, the surrounds *support* the front 3 speakers and *shouldn't* draw attention to themselves. Play around with them a bit and see what you think. Other things you could do include getting direct radiators back there (I assume you have the Paradigm dipoles), and/or lower the speaker height to more ear level rather than the typical suggestion of 2 - 3 ft above rear level.

Are you familiar with the way 5.1 sounds? I have found that the more I listen the less I notice the surrounds. It's almost like my brain expects the sound to be everwhere so I don't notice the surrounds unless somethng out of the ordinary radiates from one of them. However, I believe this is how surround is suppose to be, (can't really stand for surround in the theaters anymore). It's not until we have guests over to watch a movie that I realize just how much the surrounds contribute as I see our guest looking over their shoulder or slightly ducking during certain scenes. How big is your room? If you have a large room as I do, you may find that the surrounds are filling a lot of area not just beaming their sound to your ears.

Alejate:

I agree. Are you old enough to remember when stereo first became ubiquitous? There were lps of ping pong games with the ball bouncing between the two speakers! (How about Hendrix's guitar on Axis: Bold as Love, swirling around in our headphones?) I think the same sort of effect is working here. I just love how the heartbeat jumps from speaker to speaker in DSOTM! Have you heard the drum solo on Zappa's "Halloween" dvd-a? Far out!
Seriously, as I mature I am more willing to let the surrounds do their subtle thing. It is fun, though!

Jay

[QUOTE]Originally posted by JMS:
[B]Alejate:

Have you heard the drum solo on Zappa's "Halloween" dvd-a? Far out!
Seriously, as I mature I am more willing to let the surrounds do their subtle thing. It is fun, though!

Wow, a Zappa fan! I know, I love that solo too!

Thanks for the suggestions. While I have a good sense of test tracks for bass performance (the explosion under the wall during the Battle of Helm's Deep in The Two Towers is my current favorite test), I have not found good material for assessing surround performance. Does anyone have examples of what ought to be audible versus not from source material? I have a NetFlix subscription, so can get just about anything for test purposes.

Otherwise I am left with this vague feeling that although the meter says things are all right, they aren't.

I will try the internal pink noise when I get home. In the past, I have found that with my left/right/center, the internal noise generator does not balance correctly, while external sources do fine. (The DVD player can't be messing up the sound - I am doing a digital feed) Thus I am chary in trusting the 950's test tone to balance my speakers.

One off the top of my head is in T-3 when they're riding the topless hurse down the hill with all the twigs and leaves hitting the car... that uses the rears quite a bit... Actually the more I think about it, T3's got a good bit of surround goodness...

Any of the recent submarine flicks should work well for surround usage.

U-571
K-19
Below (Don't forget about this one!)

When a submarine submerges in "Below", I felt like I needed to hold my breath 'cause I was underwater!

Duh...I forget my favorite surround reference...

The Effects only tracks on either "A Bug's Life" or "Monster's Inc." On both of them, the ambience should really fill up the room.

[This message has been edited by Jason J (edited January 29, 2004).]

Some of the classic "panning" scenes are in the DTS versions of Casper and Dragonheart.

Casper has very good panning throughout the movie, I think the new DTS demo disk at CES showed the scene where Ricci went through the automated "get ready" ride.

Dragonheart has a nice scene where the dragon flies circles around Quaid saying something about the "old code".

Those were my reference tracks, at least in the days of laserdiscs.

I crank up my surrounds about 3-4 db. The movie "The Shadow" has some great ricocheting gunshots that are distinctly from the surrounds in the first New York scene on the bridge when the bad guys are about to dump the professor in the drink with cement overshoes. I use Mirage HTD-Rs for the surround speakers.

I boost my surrounds a dB or 2 also....just a little added ooomph!
I almost always leave ( or change to) 6.1 with most soundtracks....DTS-ES or Dolby Digital ES...I like adding that little extra with 6.1 / 7.1 surrounds if possible........
"Final Fantasy The Spirits Within" has a rip roaring soundtrack....give it a try.......