What's the best way to connect an universal player to 950 to take advantage of multi-channel music: 5.1 Outputs from player to 5.1 inputs on 950 or PCM digital connection is good enough ?
Thanks.
tvd51

I use both connections. Digital connection for DD and DTS movies or music, Analog 6 channel for DVD Audio or SACD.

Definitely use both. The 5.1 analog is essential for DVD-Audio and SACD, but you really want to use the 950's internal DACs for movies -- along with the triple crossover, EX/ES processing, and such that the 950 provides.

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gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

That means I need 5 more interconnect cables. Are Outlaw cables any good ?
tvd51

Six more -- five full-range plus LFE. And yes, the Outlaw PCA's are very good. I've got a bunch of them in my system (including half a dozen of them for my DVD-Audio player).

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gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

5 cables are all I need because I don't have a sub. What DVDA/SCAD machine are you using ? I'm thinking of buying Denon 2900 or Pioneer Elite 47Ai.
tvd51

I've got a Panasonic RA60 DVD-Audio player, no SACD (yet). If I were getting a universal player now (will eventually, but waiting to upgrade my display first), I'd look at either the Denon 2200 or 2900 or maybe the Pioneer -- and I've seen some casual but positive feedback for the new entry-level Pioneer, comparing it favorably to the 45A and 47Ai even though it retails for under $200.

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gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

That's fine but please remember you will not be able to redirect the .1 output to your main speakers, which means the subwoofer content will be lost. DVD-A and SACD have 5.1 channels.

Best,

Will

Will makes an excellent point -- DVD-A was a large part of the reason I finally bought a sub last year. Unless you add something like an ICBM to merge the LFE into the mains, you will be losing something, and depending on the specific disc you could be losing a lot.

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gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

I use the Denon 1600 and in trying different setups I noticed on certain DVD-A disks the player will not output the 6channel audio with the players sub setting set to NONE. With the sub set to none Adv. resolution stereo as well as DD And DTS all work fine.
As a side note I just set up my brothers Pioneer 563A universal player and that thing is hard to beat at $170.

Will & gonk: You mean the 950 can't direct the .1 output to the main speakers ? If this is the case I should seriously consider buying a sub. Any recommendation on a sub that goes well with NHT 2.5i (of course besides the NHT subs).
Thanks.
tvd51


[This message has been edited by tvd51 (edited December 03, 2003).]

I highly rec. an SVS or HSU Sub, but the new Outlaw LFM-1 (built w/ help from HSU) is probably a very good place to start looking too. It really depends on your budget. You probably can't go wrong with any of the three, but from personal experience Outlaw and SVS have the best customer service. I recently purchased an SVS PB2+ and though it hasn't arrived yet, I am pretty sure it will be all that I am looking for and more. If not, I can return it much like Outlaws policy.

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Stott

[This message has been edited by stott (edited December 03, 2003).]

I've had my SVS 25-31PCi for about a year and a half now and been extremely satisfied. The LFM-1 does interest me a bit, as well (and my wife even more -- a smaller and much less unusual looking piece of gear than the SVS cylinder). Both should offer excellent value and performance.

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gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

In 6 channel direct, it's not that the 950 doesn't redirect the .1 to the mains, it's the DVD player that lacks the functionality (at least the 2900 lacks it). For DD and DTS streams that go through the DVD player's digital output, the 950 will do the redirect for you.

Any of the above mentioned subs should be fine. Incidentally, an NHT 2.5i owner on http://www.audioreview.com/Main%20Speaker/NHT/PRD_121017_1594crx.aspx found the 2.5i's bass response to be "excellent, going deeper than my previous subwoofers (NHT’s Super Subs), but was able to push the 2.5i’s to their limits in some movies and pieces of classical music. I currently have them crossed over at 40 Hz to a Velodyne HGS-12 subwoofer, just to fill in the bottom octave and protect the speakers from being over-driven. This setup is, so far, virtually bomb-proof. I have not yet been able to over drive it. . ."

If you get a sub don't forget to use a sixth analog cable from your DVD player to your 950.

Best,

Will

[This message has been edited by Will (edited December 03, 2003).]

Thanks for all your comments & ideas. While waiting for buying a new sub, I think I'll direct the .1 signal to my NHT 2.5i using the 7th channel on my PVA7.
tvd51

I have a Pioneer 47Ai connected to the 950’s analog inputs via Cardas cables. I have the BM on the Pioneer all set to large with sub on. I leave the analog crossover switch on the 950 set to on. I have 5 Klipsch speakers and a Velodyne sub. I only use the analog 5.1 direct for DVDA, SACD and critical 2ch stereo listening. On the Pioneer’s digital side, which I mainly use for DD & DTS, I have a Monarchy 24/96 DIP between the Pioneers coax out and the 950’s coax in. I have the 950’s digital crossovers on all speakers set to 80hz with sub on. This configuration works very well for me.

JAMMINJC: How you like the Pioneer 47Ai? That model is one of the universal players on my shopping list along with Denon 2900 and 2200. Thanks.
tvd51

p. elite has a new model dvd player out. no rear view pics though.

tvd51-I really like the 47Ai, it really shines on the high rez stuff and has excellent 480i picture. I don't have a high def tv, so I can't say how its progressive capabilities are. I previously had a Sony 900 player which was very good, but I prefer the Pioneer over it.

For what it's worth, I use an SVS sub with my NHT 2.5's. Works great.

Be sure to leave all speakers on the universal player (or whatever player you get) set to LARGE and sub to YES (turning its bass management circuitry to OFF).

Then switch the toggle on the back of the 950 to ON and use the built in 80 Hz analog crossover.

If you leave it OFF and use the player's bass management you will get double bass routed to the sub due to a screw up in the 5.1 analog input's bass management design.

Dan

This is my reference "blow your buddie's mind" SACD. I would get a universal player, take advantage of the 950's bass management, and see if you can get a player w/ bass management (as the level controls on DVD/Super Audio are different then the level controls on Digital/Analog into the 950) see Denon 2900. Go to track #2, sit down, and wait about 5 minutes for a wild ride!

I think you're on the wrong thread...Dark Side maybe?
Yes, that's one of my demo tracks also!

Welcome back, VADER. I think it worth noting that (1) bass management is widely agreed to be important for DVD-Audio and SACD (hence the existence of Outlaw's ICBM), and that (2) JAMMINJC was referring to the 950's digital bass management --



-- which would not be used with DVD-Audio or SACD since they are connected to the 5.1 analog input.

The members of this forum have always tried to be respectful of each other. I would qualify comments like



to be the polar opposite of that respect. This forum is open to anyone, no matter what the equipment or budget. There are quite a few regulars here with extremely impressive systems, but they are polite enough not to be condescending to others. I invite you to follow their lead in the future.

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gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

TVD51,

I'm running Hsu VTF 2 (www.hsustore.com/vtf2.html) which I love. One of the nice features of the sub is the ability to configure it for either lower bass (down to 25 Hz according to Hsu) response or a slightly more powerful bass response which is better for movies. I've never hear the other two subs so I'd be hard pressed to make a comparision, but I would put the Hsu on your check it out list. Don't know your budget but they are running around $449 right now.

My LFM is on the way! I'm using three Mackie full range monitors and two slightly inferior Alesis monitors for the rear surrounds. A Pioneer universal 45A is feeding the 950 via all available outputs. As is, I get terrific sound on 6-channel bypass with plenty of bass. I'm assuming that there's unique material on the .1 channel making the lfm worthwhile. My question? Should the 45A be set to full, sub on since the six speaker/monitors will be plugged into the 950? Should I rewire the system in any way to make the sound better? (I understand that the next step is to program the inputs for SACD, DVD-A and CD separately. Right now I just punch six-channel bypass and let the 45A handle the decoding.)

Thanks for listening and writing your comments!

Jay

Yes, the 45A should be set with all speakers as "large" and the sub as "on." That should be all you need to do for SACD, DVD-Audio, and audio CD.

Some people who use the 950's DACs set up an auxiliary input in stereo mode, separate from the DVD input and the 6-channel analog. If you like using the 45A's DACs for CD's, your current method is fine.

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gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

You may want to experiment with the speaker settings a little, and see what sounds best to you. Some people with full range speakers may prefer setting speakers to "small" and have a crossover of say, 40 Hz, which lets the subwoofer play the bass punch, because even speakers rated at all the way down to 20 Hz +/- 3 dB (which is pretty good for a speaker) usually can't reproduce 20 Hz cleanly as loud as most subwoofers can, even though they may be fine at reproducing 20 Hz softly. Also if you play sounds through your speakers near their -3 dB roll off frequency, your speakers will be rolling off sound that would not get rolled off if the sound were directed instead to your subwoofer.

Best,

Will

In general, that's excellent advice (particularly for the 950's digital bass management), but in this case he's connecting the 6-channel analog ouput of his player to the 950 6-channel analog input and using the 80Hz analog crossover, so it would be best to not do any bass management at the player.

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gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

I've been enjoying the universal player Denon 2900 (gift from Santa) for couple of weeks without 6 cables to get multi-channel outputs from DVD-A and SACD. I have to use 2-channel analog output from Denon and have 'bypass' setting on 950 for all music CDs. It sounds better than my old Toshiba 4700. Hopefully, it'll sound even better when I have 6 cables to hook them up. The next thing is probably a SVS subwoofer, but I have to put it in the back of the room. How long can the subwoofer cable be without degrading the sound?
tvd51