I know this is a complete oversimplification but do cables go bad? (speaker and/or inter-connects)

Besides outright damage should a cable go bad?

I am asking becasue as my older brother keeps upgrading his system, I am lucky enough to receive all the hand me downs. So far, an Adcom 5-channel amplifier, monster speaker cables, and monster interconnects. Assuming that they are not damaged but they are a few years old should they still be good?

Do cables corrode on the inside or anything else that might just ruin them over time?

What can you do to avoid any problems with cables aging for whatever reason?

I am asking becasue if I can save money on not having to purchase new inter-connects and speaker cable it would get me to a 950 that much faster.

Thanks in advance!



[This message has been edited by NYC-EMT (edited February 20, 2004).]

A cable that is not physically damaged in some way or flawed from the beginning should last for decades. I'd use 'em.

------------------
gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

No

The old original Monster speaker cable with the clear jacket was notorious for oxidizing. It would sometimes turn green and the sound quality usually deteriorated with age.

------------------
Tekdredger

Too much hard-core rock-and-roll will make the most saintly of cables go bad.

If you want to keep your cables in "good" condition, just play "light opera" or similar muzak.

Seriously, my Acoustat speakers had this type of Monster Cable inside, complete with the green discoloration problem. Not anymore.

I suspect the problem was with the insulation outgassing clorine or somthing similar that attacked the copper.

Other than a materials problem (as in the Monster Cable problem inside the Acoustats), mere normal use in a typical domestic audio-video application will not cause deterioration of the cables.

Now watch some designer of esoteric cables state that playing the wrong type of music will cause cables to go bad. Like Lawrence Welk music will cause cables to go to sleep permanently.

Paul

------------------
the 1derful1

[This message has been edited by Paul J. Stiles (edited February 21, 2004).]

Of course not. If they did then speakers, preamps, amps, receivers, etc would all be going bad since they also use wires inside. Look at the abuse the wires in your engine compartment of your car receive and think how long they last. Save your money for the 950.

Not to mention all the wiring in your house, the national power grid, wired telecommunicaiton links etc etc....

I have the same original monster cables that tekdredger described and they do have large segments that have oxidized. I don't recall exactly how old they are, my best guess would be about 30 years old. I assume this is the result of oxygen leaking through the plastic as tekdredger described.

I am gradually coming to believe that most of the claims about cables and speaker wires from manufacturors are snakeoil, so I am interested in the boards input on whether I would notice a real difference if I replaced these cables with new cables. I am also interested in hearing suggestions on what I should replace these 11 guage cables with.

FWIW, I am using these cable to handle my main front speakers which are NHT VT 1.4's with a Parasound 1200 II 205w power amp with a 1050 as a pre-pro and center/rear amp.

I only use cables produced for the professional market such as those made by Belden and Canare. The consumer stuff made by Monster and others in this class is just too iff-y in quality and reliablility in my opinion - even the ones that cost a fortune. Most of these are made offshore by gawd-knows-who-in-who-knows-what-country.

I have never encountered a professional cable that exhibited any tendency to oxidize or otherwise change over time. Professional cables are also very inexpensive since, well, it just does not cost a lot to make wire of high quality - and they charge accordingly with no "hype markup".

Oxidation seems to me like one condition that will reasonably (and negatively) effect the way a signal is passed. Oxides are going to be poorer conductors, so as the oxidation spreads, the effective gauge of the copper conductor will shrink -- making a 16ga wire turn into an 18ga or 20ga wire, for example (sort of like closure in galvanized water pipes). 11ga cables are pretty heavy to begin with, but if the oxidation is too significant I still might think about at least tossing some 12ga Home Depot wire in to see if that makes any difference.

Soundhound makes a good point about building wiring. There are a lot of older buildings with power and telephone wiring in use that is decades old. When we do major building renovations (gut back to the shell and start over), we do sometimes call for the old wire to be pulled out, but even in buildings from the 50's or 60's that's not always done. It's more to make it easier to upgrade to newer panels, more numerous receptacles, and modern data cabling. Even after 40 years or more, the wiring should still function (barring pests gnawing through insulation and creating fire hazards).

------------------
gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

I got a pair of original Monster speaker wires from around 1985...they have turned green, but I have the ends tinned with solder, are we saying that these wires are no longer 12 guage or whatever guage they were originally? Should they be tossed?

oxided copper is not as good of a conductor as regular copper, it may even drop down to a semi-conductor. that is why people use gold plating a lot on ics, etc. having said that i dont know how much that oxidation affects the sound. its nice to get some speaker cables that are pre-terminated so that they should never oxidize on you. i use bare wire on my speakers (at the moment) and just trim off the ends every year or so to expose some fresh copper, eventually ill get some different speaker cables where i wont have to worry about oxidation though.

Tinning the exposed copper end of a speaker wire with solder will keep it from oxidizing - just remove the rosin residue from the soldering process with alcohol before using the wire. Also, most of the speaker wire I buy has tin plated strands which will never oxidize.

Hi All,

As a EE, I just couldn’t resist commenting on this thread.

Copper oxidation is an obvious (and observable) phenomenon with non-plated copper wire.

But it’s possible effects, in any area other than connection interfaces, would have to be extremely limited.

1 The oxidation layer would be rather thin. Unless you want to overplay the possible interactions with (RF) skin effects, it’s effects on the overall transmission efficiency (resistance) of a cable would have to be (IMO) almost nonexistent.

I am not talking about hazardous (vaporous) environments, this is another discussion altogether. (UL Salt Spray Test anyone?)

2 At the connection points, however copper oxide is an issue that is dealt with by gold (and other metals) plating/tinning. This is especially true in “dry circuit” applications as current flow over a few milliamps (or perhaps microamps) will also keep contact point oxidation at bay.

I have observed RF coaxial cables that have been in outdoor environments for many years and they continue to function just fine as long as the connectors are properly maintained.

Changes (hardening & cracking) of PVC insulation due to UV/ozone exposure may cause a cable to fail in time.

With coaxial cables, there can be small, long term changes in the dielectric characteristics, (characteristic impedance and velocity factor) and perhaps this could, potentially cause some “observable” changes.

Regards,

Scott

------------------
The definition of an expert is a washed up drip under pressure

[This message has been edited by SPasse (edited April 01, 2004).]

Cables, like most people, will go bad if tempted towards the dark side. I say, watch your cables like a hawk!

Jay

thinking of cables all the time tempts me to the dark side. well im usually there all the time anyway.....