Hello all - short time looker, first time poster...
I have an ICMB on the way. Is the ONLY benefit for this is SACD? My current setup uses the optical output on the DVD/SACD player for movies and CDs - I use the 5.1 for the SACDs.
Thanks!!!
My current setup:
Sony STR-DA4ES
Sony DVP-NS900v
Paradigm Monitor 7s
Paradigm CC-370
Paradigm Mini Monitors
Paradigm PDR-10
Dayton Audio ICs

As you describe your system, yes, the only benefit you will gain is for SACD/DVD-A playback.

By most user accounts it should be a BIG benefit though!

I only have 2 SACDs - Nora Jones and Pink Flyod (DSoTM) - for cost involved for 2 CDs, I sure hope it's a huge benefit :-)

That is why I haven't added an ICBM to date. I have one Peter Gabriel SACD and cannot afford to add more discs on any regular basis. I have heard a friend's system with one who has several SACD's and DVD-A'a. It will improve the sound nicely.

The ICBM is great advantage for any thing that has LFE. It is fantastic for watching movies! It adjusts how your subs blend in with your speakers and most of all adjusts for the imperfects of your room. I have one built in to a Velodyne DD-12. At only 599 it is a great buy considering the DD-12 costs $2400, but the 3000 watt amp is a nice bonus as well going down to a room rumbling 17 hz.

Ok...here is my question then.

How does the ICBM work with DTS and that?

I have my multichannel hooked up for SACD and DVD-A and an optical for DD/DTS. I've heard it does good things for DD/DTS but that means going through the analogs.

I thought DD/DTS was digital only.

What am I missing going analog versus what I am gaining with the ICBM in the middle?

On alot of DVDs I can see the need to do exactly what this unit does and I do have the options of doing it within my RX-V2600 reciever, is there a benefit to using the ICBM?

Dolby Digital and DTS can be decoded at the player or at the receiver. If it's at the player, you use the 5.1 analog output (which can pass through the ICBM) to connect the player to the receiver. If it's at the receiver, you use a digital audio cable (optical or coax) between player and receiver so the receiver can get the raw bitstream.

The benefits of handling the decoding of Dolby Digital and DTS at the receiver instead of the player are typically better bass management at the receiver (which the ICBM can offset nicely), better time delay control (which may or may not be true depending on player and receiver), and additional processing modes (Dolby EX, DTS-ES, Pro Logic II/IIx) if you have a 6.1 or 7.1 speaker setup. Additional concerns include where the better DAC's are (the player has DAC's good enough for DVD-A and SACD, but some receivers and processors do have some really solid DAC's - I prefer my 990's DAC's to my Yamaha S1500's for CD playback), which has the better DSP engine (probably not a huge difference, since in theory bits are bits and the conversion is straightforward), and how transparent the analog bypass of the receiver is with 5.1 inputs.

I tend to recommend keeping the decoding of DD and DTS tracks in the receiver. What bass management does the V2500 offer?

Thanks. I did not realize the information was still passed via analog.

Maybe I am not, well not maybe, understanding how this works. Is the "analog" output really analog, or is it digital over analog cables kind of like the coax output you can use in place of the optical?

When I saw analog I was thinking 2 channel stereo signals waveform versus a digital stream of data.

What I getting is that the multichannel outs are really just like the SPIDF style out but with each port only having 1 portion of the track.

I know this is how SACD/DVD-A work, does DTS/DD work the same?

My 2500 has quite a few options only a few of which I am now starting to understand because of waht I've read on the ICBM. I plan on sitting down and playing around with it today.

I did not care for any of the DSP modes on my 2500 and was just using STRAIGHT since it seemed to produce the best sound but maybe that is also causing me to run into the same bass problems. Every mode seemed to offer something better than the others.

Answering this question would help. Are these DSP/Decoders independant of each other? If I have it set on STRAIGHT it comes up either Dobly Digital or DTS deppending on what I am playing.

If I set it on one of the other modes I can pick Pro Logic II/IIx, Neo6, and regular Pro Logic. Do those settings superdede DD and DTS or do they apply their own rules to the DD/DTS track?

Last one...if I have it set to straight there is no bass management in the reciever, correct?

If I am not losing anything as far as straight data is concerned using the multichannel outputs then it would see, like it would be the way to go with the ICBM if it just were for simplicities sake. I just answered part of my own question here...if I use multichannel then the DVD player is doing the decoding and if I'm using optical then the receiver is doing the decoding. To make things clearer in my mind you could put in a DTS disc, hit play, hook up an amp to the multichannel, then the speakers to the amp and get DTS/DD sound without every using a reciever, correct? I know you would not want to do it but I'm just trying to think it through. Basically the data coming out of the multichannel in the back of my DVD player regardless of format(DD/DTS) would be the exact same data that would come out of the L&R/C/SR&SL/Sub out of the back of my reciever, its just being passed through the reciever with no additional processing, right?

So in this case the ICBM becomes a post processor in all cases with my setup. I have to think of the reciever as just an amp at that point in time,nothing else.

Thank you very much for your time in explaining all of this. I prefer to know the technicals of things and even at the better A/V stores don't know how things like this work.

Once I understand how the data is passed, what each mode does, and what data maybe passed via SPIDF/Optical/MultiChannel then I'll be able to setup things alot better. I've already got an email into Defintive asking for the ranges of the speakers I have. I know there is printed info but just the same I am sure there is the printed info and then there is the real sweet spot for each speaker.

We're talking good old-fashioned analog, only not the relatively convenient stereo analog (two signals, left and right) - analog output from a DVD-A, SACD, Dolby Digital, or DTS decoder means six separate analog signals (left, right, center, left surround, right surround, and subwoofer). That spaghetti is one of the reasons that digital output from a source (DVD player, digital or HD cable/satellite receiver, HD over-the-air tuner, game console, ...) is so convenient - coaxial and optical digital cables can carry the un-decoded bitstream for DD and DTS audio to the receiver over a single cable, at which point the bitstream can be decoded, processed (bass management, additional DSP modes, time delay, and what-not), and then converted to analog.

If you run all of your DVD player output (DVD-A, SACD, audio CD, DVD) over analog through the ICBM, you will basically be using the receiver as a volume control and amp. (Bypassing the 2500 and going straight to an amp would present one significant problem: no volume control.) You will not be able to apply any bass management at the receiver (I'm not sure what the 2500 offers, but some receivers such as Outlaw's Model 1070 now offer as much flexibility as the ICBM), nor will you be able to use any DSP modes (including Pro Logic II/IIx, NEO:6, Dolby EX, and DTS ES). Since you don't have surround back speakers and your player applies Pro Logic II to Dolby 2.0 sources automatically, this is not such a significant loss for you. Nonetheless, I'd suggest finding out what the 2500 can do with a digital source as far as bass management goes and compare that to the ICBM - I'd be curious to know whether the system sounds better with the DVD player handling Dolby Digital and DTS decoding and D/A conversion or with the receiver doing it.

Got it.

I ordered my unit along with some cables.

I also did some testing and suprisingly enough I am getting a .1 signal via DVD-A's that I tried out.

My DVD player decodes DTS and DolbyD. I get a .1 signal on the multichannel, when playing DolbyD: EX I do not get a .1 channel so I need to use my reciever.

I'm going to play with the bass management this afternoon when I pick up a DVD that will help me tune it. There are a ton of options and I'm sure I can weed it out just the book is not very descriptive. Going to have to play around with it.

At least the unit has a memory so I can save a few sets of adjustments and swap between them to listen and see how it is.

If anything I use the THX mode since it does seem to offer a more full sound.

On your question on which sounds better. From my small experimenting in the past minutes DTS sounds better from the reciever and DolbyD sounds better from the DVD player.

Just have to wait for my ICBM to show and hook it up.

The wife is just lovin' me this morning