SUPERMAN, the movie: Widescreen anamorphic format DD 3.2/1

For those who click in and don’t follow the convoluted process any thread I participate in might take.
Outlaws’ own Soundhound was the Music Editor for this DVD.
I had not seen this movie in years and was glad I had not, Satellite or Air Broadcast could in no way do this aging blockbuster justice. But Soundhound’s special edition, is just what was needed to evoke the excitement of that movie on the big screen when its special effects, scoring, and casting, were originally released. I enjoyed what parts I could fit in today more than I expected to, fully intending to devote a night this weekend, beginning to end. The score by Williams captures the character of this comic book hero with a memorable skill many current composers’ lack when trying to define an American Comic Book Legend, I can’t hum anything from X-Men, but I can from SM.....
The special effects without benefit of the computer generated amazing feats of current film, only made me laugh out loud once, (close your eyes when a young Clark Kent is racing the train) it has an odd artifact to it, as if the special effects guys jointed his arms and legs backwards. I think Marlon Brando never ‘looked’ better than he did as Jor-El. And while every actor hates to be labeled so, Christopher Reeve as Superman (#1) plays the only role that his talents and looks bred him for. Gene Hackman, well I like him no matter what he’s in. And Kidder is a believable if not overwhelming Lois.
What’s keeps this movie in (worth a current screening) territory, Is all the work guys (like SH) did to bring it back to big screen impact with the soundtrack.
There is some beautiful cinamaphotography shot particularly around the Kansas cornfields which almost gives this movie an old ‘Ford’ look at moments, contrasting with Metropolisis later in the film.
The DD portions when Krypton destructs is a crystalline treat moving around the channels, similar to some special effects moments I enjoyed greatly in the “Harry Potter” movie. Excellent and very effective use is made of the 6th (and/or7th) channel during the super infant's long journey from a dead planet towards his new home. Jor-El’s voice moving from the center and mains to the back is manipulated around the speakers perfectly to evoke the sensation of a long and quiet journey accompanied only by a father’s voice.

Support your local Outlaw, enjoy the soundtrack of this exceptionally well done - DVD conversion. This DD soundtrack is as a well laid and mixed as any current release. It greatly revitalizes what I remember as the best of the experience at its original release.
Now for a question. SH, you did not use the LFE channel on the ‘movie with score only’ extra. The score was more ‘musical’ to me than the DD track with effects and vocals, and the LFE was not missed, however always curious as to artistic and technical choices and manipulation behind different versions.

I didn't use the LFE because anything I put there would be "un-natural" to the intent of the music. There was nothing (like a low synthesizer's note) that would naturally fit in the LFE, and even if there was, I would probably favor folding the bass into the front left and right channels. This music is all acoustic, and orchestral (except for a short synthesizer passage in the Krypton Council music). If I put the lowest orchestra frequencies there, these problems could arise:

1) If I used the LFE for low bass, while leaving those fequencies in the mains also, there would be double bass which would only serve to muddy the sound. In addition, there could be phase cancellations from multiple sources of the same bass.

2) If I "crossed over" the bass, putting the lows in the LFE and the higher frequencies in the mains, the bass would be mono and in addition, there would be some very messy frequency division happening if the home theater used a different cross over frequency than I used.

Therefore I believed that with this orchestral music, it should be presented in as natural a way as possible. If someone has a traditional HT setup, the bass management will direct the lowest frequencies to the sub. If someone has full range speakers and does'nt use a sub (or has stereo subs like I do), the bass will be in it's natural perspective, and in stereo.

The music on the soundtrack that's mixed in with the sound effects and dialogue was "processed" to a greater extent than my mix so that it would "fit" acoustically within the total sound mix. This creates something of a comprimise, since the processing used is determined not by the needs of the music itself as much as how it fits into the total "sound" picture. I wanted to present the music score as close to the intent of the master tape as possible.

BTW, I did similar work on "The Exorcist - the version you've never seen" and "Grease"
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The Soundhound Theater


[This message has been edited by soundhound (edited February 20, 2003).]

How quickly I forget what I’m slowly picking up as it applies to varied situations. As soon as I saw your answer I realized in music only CD presentations .1 track is never involved (unless it’s a multi-track such as enhanced CD or a DVD-A low frequency distribution on CD's is handled by crossover settings etc. And in a mix trying to emulate the original analogue master, odds are you would mix it without using (or as you pointed out the low frequencies involved do not require) optioning in .1. When I think of orchestration, I often think of the extremely low frequencies certain instruments can resonate at. Why is it engineers can get away with not separating ‘out’ those instrumental low frequencies (more often mixes on acoustical CD’s) Vs say synthesized sound effects, explosives etc on DVD’s which often seem to demand the use of the .1 channel for an effective presentation? (Not sure if I even know what I am trying to say here)
I have CD’s, which beat pants off any DVD-A I currently own in presentation irregardless of higher resolution. I liked your explanation:
“The music on the soundtrack that's mixed in with the sound effects and dialogue was "processed" to a greater extent than my mix so that it would "fit" acoustically within the total sound mix. This creates something of a compromise, since the processing used is determined not by the needs of the music itself as much as how it fits into the total "sound" picture. I wanted to present the music score as close to the intent of the master tape as possible.”

There’s artistry to what you do, which overcomes limitations of formats where the net effect of the presentation can be of higher quality than mixes poorly edited at higher resolution. (not in this situation where both these tracks, the more ‘musical’ presentation of the score with/without sound effects were both laid out on one DVD. But in situations where a DVD soundtrack is released in audio only for CD, requiring different handling. Maybe that’s why if I focus on the musicality of Blockbuster DVD’s Vs CD’s I often find them lacking.

It’s almost as if they require two different experts for total effect. The pounding involvement of a movie with special effects flying around surrounds and SW rolling. (very riveting very good on many current DVD’s) But if you listen to the score (in the background) behind the dialogue and sound effects layered in, the score itself more often than not has lost ground against a CD audio only version.

Am I making sense? I have not gotten all the way through comparing the (score only) against (score with SE’s and dialogue) but differences stand out immediately. With the straight orchestration sounding best in your mix. It would be nice to have your mix pieced whole to let it run through without having to lag through scenes where the score is not synced with footage, (more as a straight music presentation) There is undeniable impact when score is rolling with special effects etc on a DVD, but there is fullness? Range? to the orchestration which is lacking on the movie presentation which is heard in your (score only) mix. It’s very fun to have opportunity to compare the two.
Did you participate on the dubbing stage for the score with movie portion also?
Do you guys ever have sound shootouts? Sort of a ‘sundance sound festival’. Someone ought to set up a competition for re-mixing the Soundtracks off a DVD for its CD counterpart to be sold. Give the same master to 5 editors, and let? pick the final version to be cut.

I'll try to cover all your questions!

There's no technical reason that the low frequencies need to be seperated out from the rest of the spectrum on a DVD, or CD. The lowest frequency likely to be encountered on an orchestral recording is about 30Hz, and that is with a bass drum. The next higher frequency would be 32Hz, and that would be the double basses, if they have the "C" extension to their lowest pitched string. Normally, a double bass has a lowest frequency of around 40Hz, (the "E" above low "C"). All these frequencies are easily handled by a full range speaker (if it's truly full range). When playing sound effects like explosions, the low frequency content is way higher in relation to the upper frequencies than with musical instruments. The only musical instument (acoustic instrument) that has really significant low frequency output is a pipe organ, which can go all the way down to 16Hz if it has a 32 foot long pipe for low "C".

Yes, there is a lot of comprimise involved when music is mixed with the sounds of expolsions and car chases. You wouldn't believe how much! It doesn't help that the music is almost always mixed under the other sounds almost all the time. If there is music in the LFE, it is almost always "synthesized" by creating a false "sub octave" below the lowest octave in the music. You don't notice this as much when there's sound effects and dialogue happening. Additionally, the surrounds are sometimes "synthesized" by the use of reverb and delay.

When a film is mixed at the final dub, I am there, but I rarely do any mixing. This is generally done by one of the two mixing engineers. One of them mixes sound effects exclusively, and the other one mixes the dialogue and music. Mixing consoles typically have well over 100 inputs, so there is a lot to keep track of. What I generally do at the dub is "keep the mixers honest" and perform any last minute editing of the score when necessary. This might be when a cymbal crash or something covers a vital line of dialogue. I then have to edit the music to clear the dialogue. Also, it is extremely common for the film's picture to be changed by the picture editor and director, even while the film is being mixed. In these cases I have to conform the music to the new cut, and if there are cuts required in the music due to a scene being deleted or added, I make the music "fit" the new cut.

There are "sound bake-offs" when the Oscars come around, but these involve the sound effects and dialogue. Us poor music editors don't have a category to receive an Oscar. There is an Emmy category however.

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The Soundhound Theater

[This message has been edited by soundhound (edited February 20, 2003).]

One more question (when and if your ever in the mood to discuss. Realize I might be misusing terminology for what I’m trying to say.

Isn’t there about 90dB dynamic range on a CD, and more on a DVD. So when you say ‘a lot’ is lost mixing music into soundtracks. Is this a process of dynamic compression? EX: the ‘Matrix’ the big lobby shootout. The melody is playing in the background but rather than being music mixed to its fullest potential, and then the dB level of the music (orchestration only) just lowered to place it below/behind the speaking voices and gunfire. Leading your ear (or my ear) into a delusional belief (since louder is perceived as better)that I lost dynamic range in the instrumentation itself when all I really lost was dB level. OR, - Is it actually loosing …air? Being compressed because transient bursts of loudness required at that point, - eat up the DR?, causing you to loose not just volume of the orchestration alone but also part of its detail? I know dynamic compression is used as a tool to make a piece sound better, but it appears abused more often than not to me.

And may I add the grass being emerald on the other side. Reading your, - “I then have to edit the music to clear the dialogue” sounds so fun. Leaning over a shoulder going “bring that up….pull that back”.
Seriously I realize…..the tedium…..the boring repetition….of going over seconds of tape….for days at a time……but…….it just ‘sounds so’ cool. Wish I was you for a day!

Actual compression is almost never used on music. The person mixing the music manually rides the level of the music to keep it at the "appropriate" level so that it always fits into the overall sound picture. I think what you are hearing as "compression" has to do with how the ear works. As the sound level gets higher, the ear acts like it's own "compressor" to a certain extent. When there is an extremely loud sound like a helicopter exploding, it "masks" the softer sounds below it. This is how processes like Dolby Digital and DTS work: they decide what they think you can't hear, so they then throw that data away. Also, when the level of the music is lowered, it loses some of it's "punch" because of the effects of the Fletcher-Munson curves. The low frequencies and to some extent the high frequencies are lost in a greater proportion than the mid range frequencies as the level is reduced. The music simply sounds less "full" at a lower volume.

It is also routine proctice to add equalization and reverb to the music, again to make it "fit" with all the other sounds. In a movie, the dialogue is always king. It must always be heard, regardless of what ever other sound is happening. If anything must give, the first is the music and sound effects.

Movies are mixed at 24 bit resolution at 48Khz sampling rate. The system is calibrated so that for a recording level of -20db below digital full scale, the sound pressure level from each speaker is 85db. Therefore, with all speakers in operation, and at the edge of clipping, the total sound pressure level can reach roughly 115db. The mixers try to keep the dialogue level close to this 85db level for normal speech. As you can see, there is limited room for everything else, so there is extensive give and take to make everything work together. This is why the mix of a typical film can take 2-4 weeks.

Yes, what I do can be fun at times, like when creating (editing together) a "suite" of music for the end credits, from music from other sections of the film. It can also be living hell when working for a tyrantical director, on a film I hate. One "casualty" of my work is that I seldom want to go out to see a movie. After watching the same movie over and over again for 12 hours a day, the last thing I want to do is, well, see a movie

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The Soundhound Theater

[This message has been edited by soundhound (edited February 20, 2003).]

Drat, I hate when I do find out I’m delusional. However canned music would not be where it is today, without the tricks of manupulating how the human ear percieves sound. Thank you for the tutorial, I will go forth……and leave you in (prob. shortlived ) peace now.

the last thing I want to do is, well, see a movie Regretfully understandable.