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#17516 - 03/14/08 01:08 AM 3 channel SACD - no sub?
RedSIinPA Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 278
Loc: Outside Phila.
Hey guys, I bought a 3ch (L/C/R) classical music SACD not long ago.

Playing it the first time, I immediately noticed that I was not getting any output on my subs. The thing is, I do get output from my subs in 2 channel analog (from the same player) with the 1070 in Bypass mode. I also get sub output with 6 ch. SACD and 5.1 ch DVD-A.

My bass management toggle is set to HPF/LPF, so I'd thought I had all this figured out such that all my analog inputs (7.1 and CD) would have frequencies below 80 Hz sent to my subs via the analog circuit built for the bass management.

Am I doing something wrong? Maybe I should revisit my Denon 1940 manual...
_________________________
Model 1070
Toshiba HD-A35 & Pioneer BDP-51
Tivo Series 3
Elite 50" / Aquos 32"
Squeezebox Radio

Stereo Setup:
NAD C326BEE (50Wx2)
Elite DV-47Ai Universal SACD/DVD-A
Citypulse DA7.2x II + TXCO DAC
B&W 685s
JL Fathom F112
Denon AH-D2000 Headphones


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#17517 - 03/14/08 11:55 AM Re: 3 channel SACD - no sub?
gonk Offline
Desperado

Registered: 03/21/01
Posts: 14054
Loc: Memphis, TN USA
Interesting CD - I haven't run across such a thing. Is it using DTS?
_________________________
gonk
HT Basics | HDMI FAQ | Pics | Remote Files | Art Show
Reviews: Index | 990 | speakers | BDP-93

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#17518 - 03/14/08 12:29 PM Re: 3 channel SACD - no sub?
KOYAAN Offline
Desperado

Registered: 09/04/05
Posts: 358
Loc: Sanford NC
I assume your listening to the SACD via the 7.1 Annalog input. That being the case, the 1070 should apply the same processing to a 3.1 signal that it does to a 5.1 signal. Are you dooing anything differently with this SACD than with others ?
What SACD is it ?
_________________________
HT:
990/770
Oppo BD83SE
Pioneer Elite DV-47A
Magnavox HDMR513h DVR/DVD-R
Sony DVD megachangers-2
Sony CD megachangers-2
Monster power centers-2
Sony 48" rear projection SDTV
Roku video player
JVC AL-A158 Turntable
Polk RT-2000s,CS-650,XS-650s,RT80s
LFM-1EX
Hsu VTF-1
12" Velodyne

Family room:
OPPO 970
Sony 32" direct view HDTV
Denon 3801
Rolk RMs

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#17519 - 03/14/08 12:40 PM Re: 3 channel SACD - no sub?
RedSIinPA Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 278
Loc: Outside Phila.
hey guys - here's the disc I bought. I don't think it's a 3.1 disc. It's a 3.0 disc. Still I wouldn't think it matters since CD's are simply 2.0 discs and I get sub output on them.

It's not DTS btw - I don't think anyway. I see no DTS logo.

TIA -

http://www.amazon.com/Rimsky-Korsakov-Sc...05498692&sr=8-1

Oh, and yes I'm using the 7.1 analog inputs for my player and using that source on my 1070 during playback...
_________________________
Model 1070
Toshiba HD-A35 & Pioneer BDP-51
Tivo Series 3
Elite 50" / Aquos 32"
Squeezebox Radio

Stereo Setup:
NAD C326BEE (50Wx2)
Elite DV-47Ai Universal SACD/DVD-A
Citypulse DA7.2x II + TXCO DAC
B&W 685s
JL Fathom F112
Denon AH-D2000 Headphones


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#17520 - 03/14/08 01:49 PM Re: 3 channel SACD - no sub?
gonk Offline
Desperado

Registered: 03/21/01
Posts: 14054
Loc: Memphis, TN USA
That is a hybrid SACD, and a 3.0 disc from what I found on it. The CD layer would be purely 2.0 (and there is one, as it's a hybrid), but the Denon would be playing the SACD layer. My first thought is rather simple - the 80Hz crossover will only provide a signal for the sub when there is material present below 80hz in the recording (no LFE track), and I have no idea just how much content of this type may exist in the recording.
_________________________
gonk
HT Basics | HDMI FAQ | Pics | Remote Files | Art Show
Reviews: Index | 990 | speakers | BDP-93

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#17521 - 03/14/08 02:16 PM Re: 3 channel SACD - no sub?
RedSIinPA Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 278
Loc: Outside Phila.
Gonk I'm thinking the same thing. There's a lot of violin and not a lot of percussion in this recording. Makes me think my subs went to sleep. Though I did verify that the subs are not on Auto anymore. They wake up too slowly from slumber in Auto-On mode.
_________________________
Model 1070
Toshiba HD-A35 & Pioneer BDP-51
Tivo Series 3
Elite 50" / Aquos 32"
Squeezebox Radio

Stereo Setup:
NAD C326BEE (50Wx2)
Elite DV-47Ai Universal SACD/DVD-A
Citypulse DA7.2x II + TXCO DAC
B&W 685s
JL Fathom F112
Denon AH-D2000 Headphones


Top
#17522 - 03/14/08 04:48 PM Re: 3 channel SACD - no sub?
KOYAAN Offline
Desperado

Registered: 09/04/05
Posts: 358
Loc: Sanford NC
I'm not familiar with this particular recording, But I know the works pretty well. Niether is going to give you subwoofer a workout, but both, particularly the Scherazade has a fair amount of tymponi and some deep strings that I would expect to extend well below 80 hz.
_________________________
HT:
990/770
Oppo BD83SE
Pioneer Elite DV-47A
Magnavox HDMR513h DVR/DVD-R
Sony DVD megachangers-2
Sony CD megachangers-2
Monster power centers-2
Sony 48" rear projection SDTV
Roku video player
JVC AL-A158 Turntable
Polk RT-2000s,CS-650,XS-650s,RT80s
LFM-1EX
Hsu VTF-1
12" Velodyne

Family room:
OPPO 970
Sony 32" direct view HDTV
Denon 3801
Rolk RMs

Top
#17523 - 03/14/08 08:22 PM Re: 3 channel SACD - no sub?
RedSIinPA Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 278
Loc: Outside Phila.
^that's what I was thinking as well...something ought to get them going, and I'm striking out thus far. I'm going to recheck my stuff tonight and give it another whirl. Thanks for the feedback thus far.
_________________________
Model 1070
Toshiba HD-A35 & Pioneer BDP-51
Tivo Series 3
Elite 50" / Aquos 32"
Squeezebox Radio

Stereo Setup:
NAD C326BEE (50Wx2)
Elite DV-47Ai Universal SACD/DVD-A
Citypulse DA7.2x II + TXCO DAC
B&W 685s
JL Fathom F112
Denon AH-D2000 Headphones


Top
#17524 - 03/15/08 12:10 AM Re: 3 channel SACD - no sub?
gonk Offline
Desperado

Registered: 03/21/01
Posts: 14054
Loc: Memphis, TN USA
Is it a good disc? I might pick it up and give it a whirl, see what it does with my 990 and 983H...
_________________________
gonk
HT Basics | HDMI FAQ | Pics | Remote Files | Art Show
Reviews: Index | 990 | speakers | BDP-93

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#17525 - 03/15/08 03:57 AM Re: 3 channel SACD - no sub?
RedSIinPA Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 278
Loc: Outside Phila.
to be honest Gonk, this is my first purchase of Classical music outside of a few random Beethoven and Tchaikovsky discs I purchased years ago. My daughter was born almost 3 weeks ago and that gave me a good reason to invest in some more "soothing" music. plus I like to read to it when the long days come to an end.

I've listened to it twice. While I don't have the background to compare it to other works, I feel it was a good purchase. I have to listen to it a lot more to really tell if I'm a true fan, but so far it's been fun. The reviews on Amazon are what led me to this particular one, but I think it would be pretty cool to collect the whole Living Stereo series. I think I'll buy a couple more tonight actually smile
_________________________
Model 1070
Toshiba HD-A35 & Pioneer BDP-51
Tivo Series 3
Elite 50" / Aquos 32"
Squeezebox Radio

Stereo Setup:
NAD C326BEE (50Wx2)
Elite DV-47Ai Universal SACD/DVD-A
Citypulse DA7.2x II + TXCO DAC
B&W 685s
JL Fathom F112
Denon AH-D2000 Headphones


Top
#17526 - 03/15/08 04:09 AM Re: 3 channel SACD - no sub?
RedSIinPA Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 278
Loc: Outside Phila.
I got a little volume behind the system just now and did the old hand-on-the-sub - it's working. Sorry guys for asking a question I should've doublechecked on my own. Hopefully you at least glean some interest in the music from this thread!

I just googled the "Living Stereo" series and wow, this series is HUGE!

http://www.livingstereo-sacd.com/

click the Albums link...
_________________________
Model 1070
Toshiba HD-A35 & Pioneer BDP-51
Tivo Series 3
Elite 50" / Aquos 32"
Squeezebox Radio

Stereo Setup:
NAD C326BEE (50Wx2)
Elite DV-47Ai Universal SACD/DVD-A
Citypulse DA7.2x II + TXCO DAC
B&W 685s
JL Fathom F112
Denon AH-D2000 Headphones


Top
#17527 - 03/15/08 03:44 PM Re: 3 channel SACD - no sub?
Altec Offline
Desperado

Registered: 01/06/08
Posts: 334
RCA's living stereo, along with Everest, Mercury living presence, Westminster and a few others I probably can't recall were the standard of the day for the "golden age" of stereo in the 1950s and early 1960s. These were all recorded with very pure-sounding analog vacuum tube equipment, some on 35mm magnetic film, which is wider and moves faster than the standard analog magnetic tape.

Their sound quality has never since since been equalled with the exception of those recordings which use either vintage gear from that era (I do this for some of my recording signal chain), or use modern reproductions of vintage gear. Additionally there are many modern designs which use vacuum tube technology, and today's recording engineers value the sound of this highly. The microphones from this era fetch unreal amounts of money.

Jazz recordings from this era in particular benefit from the extremely "organic" sound of the vacuum tube gear and analog signal path.

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#17528 - 03/15/08 05:25 PM Re: 3 channel SACD - no sub?
psyprof1 Offline
Desperado

Registered: 09/10/05
Posts: 443
Loc: Santa Barbara, CA
RedSIinPA, I'm glad you like classical music but if you think of it as "soothing" I suggest a few ear openers: Orff's "Carmina Burana"; the last 2 movements of Berlioz's "Symphonie Fantastique"; the opening of the last movement of Beethoven's Ninth; any symphony by Gustav Mahler except maybe the Fourth (his music has the best claim to the word "titanic" of any I know); and of course Stravinsky's "Rite of Spring", particularly the last section. Any of those ought to wake your ears up, biiig time. They're also tougher tests than ANY other type of material for the quality level, as well as power, of the whole reproducing chain.
I'm sure lots of you all reading this could name hundreds of others, no problem.

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#17529 - 03/15/08 07:27 PM Re: 3 channel SACD - no sub?
Altec Offline
Desperado

Registered: 01/06/08
Posts: 334
When I think of "soothing", string quartets come to mind. The potboiler symphonic works are generally not what I'd call soothing. Great music, yes. Soothing, not so.

Ralph Vaughan Williams'"Pastoral" symphony (#3)is soothing. His "Fantasia on a Theme by Thomas Tallis" is another "soothing" work, as is "Fantasia on Greensleeves".

Shostakovich is not what I'd call "soothing".... wink

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#17530 - 03/15/08 10:02 PM Re: 3 channel SACD - no sub?
psyprof1 Offline
Desperado

Registered: 09/10/05
Posts: 443
Loc: Santa Barbara, CA
Very good! - and I sure agree on the VW pieces and Shostakovich.

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#17531 - 03/16/08 12:42 AM Re: 3 channel SACD - no sub?
Altec Offline
Desperado

Registered: 01/06/08
Posts: 334
Quote:
Originally posted by psyprof1:
Very good! - and I sure agree on the VW pieces and Shostakovich.
Then again, there's Vaughan Willaims' 4th symphony...... Maybe he finally got pissed off from writing so much "soothing" music and wanted to try something....er....different.... eek

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#17532 - 03/16/08 02:43 AM Re: 3 channel SACD - no sub?
RedSIinPA Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 278
Loc: Outside Phila.
thank you for the recommendations!
_________________________
Model 1070
Toshiba HD-A35 & Pioneer BDP-51
Tivo Series 3
Elite 50" / Aquos 32"
Squeezebox Radio

Stereo Setup:
NAD C326BEE (50Wx2)
Elite DV-47Ai Universal SACD/DVD-A
Citypulse DA7.2x II + TXCO DAC
B&W 685s
JL Fathom F112
Denon AH-D2000 Headphones


Top
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