I know this was probably discussed before, but I cannot find it:

We have SXRD Sony 60 inch and I am considering Oppo, which would be the 971 with the Faroujda chip. Here are the questions:

1. Will I see a significant improvement in standard definition DVDs?

2. Will the new HD players (BluRay or HD-DVD)produce significant improvement on standard definition DVDs.

Where this is leading is that I would think it wise to wait and not waste $$ if #2 scenario will suffice for both HD and standard Def DVDs.

3d question: Considering that we get an Oppo 971 and when Blu Ray or whatever is bought, nove the Oppo to a standard def TV, will the picture be OK.

THanks guys.

1. Yes, if you use the DVI output of the player.
2. No.
3. Someone is complaining on the 990 forum that the Oppo looks crappy on the analog video output. I haven't noticed that myself.

Cheers,

Thanks Ritz. Appreciated. So, since the new HD playhers won't improve the current DVDs, perhaps they don't contain whatever it is that improves.

Is that assumption correct? Is it the Faroujda chip?

So in that case if I want to use the features of my HDTV (Sony SXRD) when playing current DVDs I would need something like the Oppo 971...Correct?? Thanks for your "inputs" [pun not-intended].

How good any HD-DVD or Blu-ray player will perform with standard DVD's is going to depend entirely on the player. The Toshiba HD players reportedly do a pretty respectable job of upscaling, but it's not any better than the OPPO. The Samsung BD-P1000 has not gotten much attention because it appears to have some significant issues and it lacks support for too many Blu-ray features, so I haven't heard anything about it's performance with DVD's.

When playing DVD's on an HDTV, there comes a point somewhere along the way where the DVD's 480i signal must be scaled up to HD resolution. That can be within the TV itself (the most common way), or in the player itself (as with the OPPO). Which one is better depends on which device has the best scaling and deinterlacing capabilities. I don't know how good your Sony's internal scaler/deinterlacer is, but the OPPO's Faroudja chip does a pretty fine job - better than most typical HDTV's.

How do I control this? I mean what do I need to do to make sure that the TV scales up the resolution, not the DVD player? or vise versa.

Thanks,

The TV will automatically scale the incoming signal to match it's display resolution (it has to), but if the DVD player has already provided the scaling then the TV will simply verify the resolution and then display the signal.

Thanks gonk.

So in a way, I can control the DVD player scale by sending the signal over as 480I and the TV will automatically scale the incoming to match its display resolution. And not the TV.

Yep, I think you've got it. With the DVD player set to 480i, all scaling responsibilities lie with the TV. This is the same premise used by folks with fancy standalone video scalers: they want to get 480i from the DVD player because they only want scaling and deinterlacing to be done by their really smart scaler.

How do i know which has a better scaler, my tv or dvd player. I have a denon 2910 and a sony sxrd 60xbr1. I am not even sure on how to have my TV upconvert the signal. Anyone have any idea?

Your DVD player probably has a better scaler than your TV. The 2910 uses the same Faroudja chip for scaling that the Oppo 971 uses, and the 971 is supposed to do an excellent job of scaling. I haven't heard of a TV that has a built-in scaler of this quality.

And, btw, to have your TV upconvert a signal, all you do is send it a signal that is at below its native resolution. DVDs (NTSC DVDs, anyway) have 480 lines of resolution. If you have an HDTV, it has more than 480 lines of resolution. Any time your TV is displaying anything it is displaying it at its native resolution. If the signal it is sent is not at that resolution, the TV converts it to the appropriate resolution.

lawtaker wrote:

f you have an HDTV, it has more than 480 lines of resolution. Any time your TV is displaying anything it is displaying it at its native resolution. If the signal it is sent is not at that resolution, the TV converts it to the appropriate resolution.

So then if you have a SXRD-based HDTV there is no need for an Oppo or other with Faroudja chip since the HDTV trumps the 480 DVD players...right ?

If yes, then I guess I finally get it. No need for Oppo or Faroudja. Just wait for Blu Ray or other.

Remember - it all depends on how good a scaler the TV has and how good the video section of the DVD player is. Also remember that we're not talking about how good a job the TV does displaying a true HD source versus how good it does with a DVD: that's like comparing a recording on your Alesis to a cassette tape. We're talking about the difference in picture quality between a DVD played in your Sony DVPCX955 on your TV and a DVD played on a player like the OPPO through the same TV. That is where a player like the OPPO can provide benefits (in some cases, very noticeable benefits).

Nope.

Issue #1: If your HDTV set receives a signal at a lower res than its native res, it will upscale it. This is true regardless of whether you have an SXRD-based HDTV. It's true for all HDTV sets. This is because an HDTV set can only display things at its native res. So if you see an image on your HDTV set, it's at its native res. And thus if the signal the HDTV received was at a lower res, it necessarily follows that the HDTV must have upscaled it.

Issue #2: Not all scalers are created equal. The scaler in your HDTV is probably less than fabulous. The scaler in an Oppo DVD player is almost certainly better. There are external scalers that are better still.

So let's work through some examples.

Let's say your source material is a US DVD. That source material is 480i (480 lines, interlaced).

Let's say you have an HDTV. Let's say it's an LCD with 720 lines of resolution. that's 720p.

Now you want to watch that DVD on your LCD.

Option 1: DVD player without a scaler (or with upscaling turned off), connected to your HDTV set.

Option 2: Oppo DVD player (upscaling DVD player with a good scaler), connected to your HDTV set.

Option 3: DVD player without a scaler, or with upscaling turned off, connected to an external scaler, which is connected to your HDTV set.

In all three options, the 480i signal that you start with will display at 720p.

In option 1, your DVD player sends a 480i signal, which the TV receives and upscales itself.

In option 2, your DVD player upscales the signal sending a 720p signal to your TV, which displays it without further scaling.

In option 3, your DVD player sends a 480i signal to the external scaler, which upscales it to 720p, which your TV receives and displays without further upscaling.

Option 3 yields the best picture, followed by option 2, followed by option 1.

This is because the external scaler has the best scaler, and the typical HDTV set has the worst.

Thanks fellas.
Perhaps a little thick, but I think I've got it straight, now.

Actually some (read that as very few) CRT HDTV sets can display multiple format resolutions without scaling as when done right CRT is a multi-resolution technology...which is one of the strengths of CRT.

Of course multi-scan/sync HDTV is expensive to do so most of the CRT based HDTVs out there only do 1080.

Just wanted people to know though that not all displays need to scale everything to fit its native resolution.

Oh and I highly suggest going with the Oppo to your HD TV. Noticeably better scaler/deinterlacer in it than what's in the Sony.

BloggingITGuy wrote:

I highly suggest going with the Oppo to your HD TV

I would pull trigger right now for Oppo 971, but I keep wondering whether the HD-DVD & Blu-ray DVD players will incorporate that function for which I would buy an Oppo now.

What do you think ITGuy...

Yes, the HD-DVD players will upscale, but from everything that I've read, none of the currently available HD-DVD players have nearly as good of a scaler as the good DVD players like the Oppo or the higher end Denons.

Ask yourself how long you think you will use a good DVD player...at this point the answer should be at least 3 to 5 years, maybe more.

DVDs certainly aren't going away until consumers have a clear choice on which HD media player to go with and that's not likely to happen for at least another 2 years as manufacturers ramp up production on new players. In particular, I don't think that the HD movie formats will make much inroads into the regular consumer market until the major players all have universal HD players and offer them for less than $300.

Thanks BloggingIT Guy.
I pulled the triger on 1 971 this morning. Your post this afternoon certainly provides "sound" (pun-unintended ) advice. What you wrote makes sense.

Cool hope you enjoy it.

I have only minor complaints about the Oppo myself, like slightly slower than expected startup time (certainly nothing as bad as what I've been hearing about the Toshiba HD-DVD players), the fact that it doesn't pull in the drive tray when the power button on the unit is pressed - although it does if the power button on the remote is pressed - I know...odd, and sometimes it doesn't do so well when rendering subtitles.

My thanks to gonk, BloggingITGuy,lawtalker and RITZ. Your comments helped me. I bought the 971 Oppo and found that it is superior in both video and audio. It makes my nice Sony seem better, though admittedly standard DVDs are HD yet, so I'm realistic in my expectations.

The audio seems even better. It seems that the 990 recognizes what surround mode the Oppo is sending it. I say this because I am seeing Dolby D designation, for example, which I have never seen displayed via the 990.

So again...thanks fellas.

This comment reminded me of a quirk with Sony DVD players. If you ever decide to use your Sony in another room and/or system, go into the set-up menu and change the digital audio output from "PCM" to "Dolby Digital" (On the DTS option, change it to "DTS".) Sony players default to "PCM" which only sends a stereo signal to your processor. It sounds like your Oppo player defaults to the correct options which is why you're now hearing true, discrete 5.1 Dolby Digital sound.

It's not just Sony that exhibits this type of quirk - many manufacturers have routinely set the DTS default output to PCM. My Oppo was only the second player I've ever owned that properly defaulted DTS to a bitstream output (my Yamaha S1500 was the first).

I loved my Oppo 971 but it is sitting unconnected since I got the Toshiba HD DVD player. The Tosh is a superb upconverting DVD player in terms of PQ. It lacks a bit in functionality (slow response, clunky design). I will probably sell my Oppo. I do miss the DVD-Audio playback capability, but that has largely been a novelty item for me.

By my use of the Silicon Graphix HQV Benchmark DVD the Toshiba and the Oppo are comparable, although the Tosh does better with 3:2 pulldown (racetrack seating Moire patterns) and worse on the scrolling text over a films source.