I just cancelled an upgrade to a HD Recording system from my cable provider, Time Warner, because the installer told me that the device, a SA8000HD recorder, does not support digital audio out (even though it has both digital audio via RCA and optical) either for watching cable directly or recording.

I then went looking for an digital recorder including a Pioneer unit that had both a DVD recorder and an 80GB Hard Disk. It did not appear as if any of the units I saw could record DD5.1 as they did not have any type of digital audio input.

Are there any devices that record dd5.1? If the stand alone devices don't do this, do computer based recorders?

The DVD recorders that I've looked at (including my Panasonic DMR-E80) do not support recording Dolby Digital 5.1 - something that I've attributed to Hollywood worrying about piracy more than anything else. You may be able to record Dolby 5.1 with some computer based systems, but I haven't researched it enough to know for sure. There's a pretty significant amount of information available online about HTPC's, which should give some insight on the subject.

I'm a bit surprised that the SA8000HD does not support digital audio output. I know that Scientific Atlanta's digital cable boxes have been a bit behind the curve on supporting digital audio (which is why I've been using Pace boxes for the last few years - Pace's boxes will convert analog audio stations to PCM and pass that to the digital audio output when there isn't a digital audio channel included in the signal). The idea that a high-def cable box doesn't support digital audio output sounds like a misrepresentation to me, or else like a cable provider doing something really stupid.

Gonk: Regarding the SA8000HD, I share your surprise and feelings about SA. However, the installer implied that it was a firmware issue with the SA8000HD, that it might have this capability in the future, he just didn't know when. He further stated that there was a major disagreement between the installers and marketing, with the installers feeling they need to tell people about the product and marketing keeping quiet. I guess if you are using an HDTV without a HT receiver system (not part of the outlaw target audience) this functionality gap is meaningless.

FWIW, I also share your experience with SA boxes in general. Fortunately, TW will let you switch from a SA box to a Pioneer HD box that does the same conversion as the Pace boxes.

Heh. My DirecTV TiVo box (two tuners, 70hrs, mmm good... ) records the 5.1 audio that DirecTV carries. It's got an optical audio-out port, too. For $50 installed with a dual-LNB dish, I'd call it a good deal!

Cancel your cable...come to the dark side...

Unfortunately, DirectTV is not competative price wise with TW cable (for me). I have a family of 4 (teenagers and adults) with diverse viewing preferences. The big difference is the extra $20 per month that Direct charges for additional boxes that I don't need to provide currently as the family seems content with basic cable on the other non-HD TV's. Also while the content prices are roughly comparable, TW has some sweet spots in their rate table versus cable that I am able to take advantage of. So I believe the difference is more like $40 to $50 per month. Finally, since there doesn't seem to be a deal that includes both multiple Direct-tv receivers and HDTV recording capability, so going with Direct-TV would also include the layout for equipment and a custom installation.

This doesn't include that I get 3Mb+ response time from TW's ISP service and IP phone with unlimited local and long distance plus minor phone services for an additional 79.95. Thats less then I would pay my local carrier Verizon for lower levels of DSL and phone service.

Time Warner's bumping their cable modem transfer rates up to 5Mb, at least in my market. From what I've heard, we're supposed to see the increase here some time this month, and it's apparantly part of a widespread process throughout their network - so you may see the same in your area (if you haven't already).

Sounds like you definitely found the "sweet spot", 73Bruin. For us, a cable modem isn't an option, so DSL and DirecTV is definitely the cheapest combination. Just adding data points...

I am not trying to make this into a TW ad because they definitely have some issues, but I have noticed a speed increase recently, and that seemed to happen the same day I got their IP telephone service. TW is also advertising a premium service that includes a guaranteed 6MB download rate and double the upload rate. However, the 3+ MB service I am getting now is plenty quick enough for our family.

Getting back to the original question...I just got a SA8000HD converter/DVR yesterday from Time Warner. It has two tuners so yes it can record two programs at the same time. They also claim (I haven't tried this yet) that you can watch either of the programs while they are being recorded or a third previously recorded program. Pretty impressive if it actually works as claimed. It isn't clear if that applies when recording in HD or not. I think that would take some serious computing horsepower inside the box.

I did try the digital output via the coaxial jack and it functioned on all channels, something my previous Pioneer converter did not do. The analog channels putting out a PCM signal and the digital and HD channels an assortment of Dolby Digital formats, mostly 2.0. There is a slight reacquisition delay through the Outlaw 950 but not excessive in my opinion. In fact when surfing between channels that output PCM there is no break or delay at all. But when switching between PCM and DD or even between two DD channels then there is a break and a resynching.

The most dissappointing aspect of the SA8000HD is the currently disabled DVI port. SA claims it is disabled while they develop HDCP compliance. They promise a download to enable the port in early '05. The sales guy at Time Warner told me that some of their early boxes from SA came with the port enabled but then they pulled back. Some Hollywood lawyers probably put an end to that if the port wasn't HDCP compliant. So for me it's component video for now. Hopefully I won't have to wait too long. A set of VCR archive outputs are also not operational awaiting a "future enhancement". It seems like SA wanted to get this box quick to market with the hardware and is continuing to write the software after it's in the field.

There are a couple other interesting aspects about the way this box operates. First it operates in either HD or SD modes but not both simultaneously. When in HD mode all the standard def jacks are dead (i.e. composite and S-video). This is kind of frustrating for me since I have it hooked to two different displays, one HD and an older SD RPTV for more casual viewing. When I want to switch displays I have to turn off the converter and go through a button pushing sequence during reboot to change the operational mode. The good news, and this is contrary to anything I was told or read, the HD channels ARE displayed when in the SD mode, albeit at the lower resolution and letterboxed.