I am really loving my new 950/755 combo, and my new DVD player, the Denon DVD3800. I am just beginning to get into some DVD-Audio, and am loving it (some multi channel music sounds incredible...)....now I want to hear some SACD's.....and I guess I need another player...( love my 3800 too much to consider chucking it and starting over.....it is a beautiful player I got at a bargain price....)since it doesn't seem likely that we will be seeing releases done in both formats...it seems to be either/or....
I am also not able to spend alot...for various reasons....tax time, etc.....
Any ideas on a pretty good, but not really expensive SACD player?? Looking at the SONY DVP-NS755V PLAYER...it is in my budget....any other ideas??? Also, what would I do about having two 5.1 outputs with only one 5.1 input?? Radio Shack??? What parts would you use to make something like that work???

I use the Sony DVP-NS500V and it works great for me. I got it for under $200 new. Unfortunately, it's not made anymore. But if you find a used one...

The Sony is a good deal for SACD playback. Don't forget, there are some SACD/CD only players out there for around $200. If you already have DVD taken care of, there are some other options.

People have used the Radio Shack switch boxes to good effect. You need three stereo switchers for that option.

My idea for Outlaw on this matter is in the "New Product Suggestion" saloon. See the thread on the multi-channel ICBM.

I just heard a great demo of SACD technology at the Audio Engineering Society convention in NYC. Sennheiser and Neumann recorded the Basie Big Band in multi-channel DSD. Playback was from a Genex hard disk recorder going through Meitner DACs and a Meitner Switchmann box. Speakers were Avalon monitors powered by a BAT amp. Let me just say that I've never heard a trumpet sound that "live" on playback. Amazing image also..

Well, hope all this helps. Good luck!

Yep, I figured I would need three switchers...that kinda sucks....your idea is a good one, and quite valid. Those things would sell!! A really good thread.....Zektors MAS3 is a little out of my budget range.....(thank you, Radio Shack)
A cool piece of equipment though...
I figured Sony would have an edge with SACD....for obvious reasons.....might try the NS755....$229..00 at Crutchfield, $199.00 at Stereo Advantage...
now, if Outlaw would make that switcher/ICBM I would have it made.....
just gotta try SACD, because if it is anything like DVD-Audio, I AM HOOKED!!!!
What a sucker I am!!!!
I am hoping there are other "suckers" out there too.....
gonna keep diggin' and lookin' into it....

WHY ALWAYS TWO FORMATS??? IS IT SOME RULE OR SOMETHING????????

I just bought the Pioneer DV-563 for $180 so I could enjoy both SACD and DVD-A. What I like about this player is it automatically detects whether the sound should be sent out through the 5.1 analog or the digital out. I'm not sure if its a big deal to others, but my Toshiba DVD-A player made me have to go into the menu everytime to change the audio out. It does have bass management as well but since I am an 950 owner I don't need it.

[This message has been edited by Jed M (edited October 18, 2003).]

I am looking into the Pioneer Player too.....a really good price!!!!
.......gotta look for some reviews ...I'll check into it.....

It may not matter for your listening pleasure, but that Pioneer player downconverts DSD to PCM on playback. It probably still sounds pretty good but it isn't the true SACD experience.

A note on the above comment: One of the facets of DSD over PCM that I like is that with DSD, I can listen to the whole album without getting what I like to call, "the digital headache." Basically, long term digital listening gives me this nice dull headache. I usually contribute it to the fact my brain has to do some work to complete the waveform from all those little samples. With analog, oh yeah!, and DSD, I don't seem to be affected by this side effect. This is the reason that I don't like the concept of downconverting DSD to PCM. Oh well, just my .02 cents...

I would bet the Sony sounds a lot better with SACD than that Pioneer. Also, I would bet that your Denon sounds better with DVD-Audio. IMHO, if you already have DVD-Audio, I would go for the dedicated SACD player.

Why two formats? Competition

Don't know your price range, but there's 3 Denons on the market at this point that are universal players (DVD-audio w/SACD no downconversion of SACD). The DVD-2200 ($525 new on ebay), the DVD-2900 ($899 new on ebay or etronics.com) and the DVD-5900 ($3000 on etronics.com). There seems to be no discernable difference between the 2200 and the 2900 other than the 2900 is 7lbs heavier. I've emailed several retailers and even Denon concerning the difference.,Denon has not seen fit to reply, but the retailers say there is no functional difference other than the weight. The reviews for the 2900 have been astounding, whereas the 2200 is too new to have any reviews.

Jason, The Pioneer only downconverts DSD to LPCM only if you are using the bass management. For those of us who own a 950 or ICBM and don't need BM it goes from DSD to Analog directly, just like your Sony. I'm not sure about your bet, but I have been very pleased with the DVD-A and SACD sound quality.

Jed: I had not heard this before anywhere. Did you discover this online or is this information only available in the literature that comes with the unit? Having output available without downconverting would be a great solution for many of us.

BBFTB, its hard to say really, and I may be wrong, but here (along with some posts scattered here and there) is where I got my info, about half way down the page. http://slottweak.com/DV_563A/563review.htm

Here is the direct quote in case somebody can't find it:
"The way Pioneer elected to do DSD conversion for SACD's is quite interesting, and not unlike a couple of very expensive and well regarded SACD players. With Bass Management off, the signal goes from DSD to Analog directly, and with Bass Management on, it goes from DSD to LPCM to Analog."

I've got a Marantz DV-8400 and it's great. Not cheap but a wonderful player. It's plays just about every format known to man. I've had lesser players and I can hear the difference. YMMV though...

Sorry, I just read the part of your message that mentions a budget. My bad. Nevermind :-)

Lawrence

[This message has been edited by foamx (edited October 22, 2003).]

I'm a new convert to SACD. I tried the Sony DVD 999ES and I own the 775 carousel. I can't recommed either one. In both cases, the CD layer sounds better going through my DAC2 than the SACD layer through the unit's internal DAC. However the Denon 5900 changes all that. SACD sounds wonderful, amazing, better than my Bel Canto DAC2. And picture is superb. What a unit!!!!

I would LOVE to have the Denon 5900, but it is a little pricey for me, and I just bought a Denon 3800 (refurbished, affordable, and, spectacular)....I know the 5900 is the culmination of what Denon has been striving for, and from all reports, and my research too, I think they have acccomplished near perfection! I wish I could have the 5900, but am happy with the 3800 for now, and it was incredibly affordable.....I would assume the 5900 goes for about $1500.00 or so.......
man, I wish........
but that is why I said I have a budget.....I really do!!! Especially explaining any new purchase (and one over $1000.00)to my wife!!!
It was a lot easier to justify a purchase when single...would just ask myself, and voila!!!
You have the best player out there in my opinion with the 5900.....
Outlaws really know there stuff, but Denon really knows DVD and CD players, and builds with a quality like no other...unless we're talking ridiculously overbuilt mega bucks players.....
So, in my budget range($200.00 or so...), and with the reviews I have read, Sony or Pioneer seem to have pretty good SACD reproduction, and that is what I was trying to confirm.......
Can I get a pretty good sounding SACD player in my budget range????
Anybody else??????

[This message has been edited by daddy_guy (edited October 22, 2003).]

I sell the DV-563a at work. It's a good unit all-in-all, because it's universal, you'll only need one set of 6 channel analog cables to your reciever to get both DVD-Audio and SACD (which is going to be very handy because the vast majority of recievers/processors only have 1 analog 6 channel input.

I was curious about this DV-563 conversion issue so I emailed Pioneer. They responded,

"The DV-563 does not downconvert DSD to PCM before outputting analog."

Forgive me. I erased the original email so the above statement is a paraphrase of what they said.

So, I stand corrected by the manufacturer. Let the comparison tests begin!!

[This message has been edited by Jason J (edited October 27, 2003).]

As I say, I sell these at work. Talking with the Pioneer rep today, he made the statemet similar to Jed M. The downconversion only occurs if you use the onboard bass management system. If you bypass the bass management, then no downconversion occurs.

Embries,
Thanks for your input
Have you had a chance to compare the Pioneer DV-563 with the Sony DVP-NS755 at work??? These are the two players I am looking really hard at......I figured because Sony invented SACD, they might have the edge....but you have got me thinking.......
I sure would like an Affordable SACD Player.......it is the cabling nightmare and switch boxes that are my next nightmare.....man, that would sure be a mess of cables with two 5.1 players!!!! And I worry about using those Radio Shack Switchers (I heard I should modify (remove 2 small resistors??)if I use the Video plug as a third audio plug...)!!! But there is nothing else out there under $400.00 to use!!!!!
Oh, the things we do for.......good sounds and good movies!!!

I have indeed listened to both at work (however the store in which I work requires us to play music on overhead speakers, so the listening environment is not 100% clean). Having said that, I could honestly tell no difference in the two players on the SACDs which I tried. It could be that the Pioneer Elite reciever is incapable of highlighting the differences, subtle as they must be. The sound system is all Polk Audio with the RT 100s for the front RT70i's for the rear. Again, without the benefit of a 'listening room' I was unable to hear any sonic differences between the two players.