Care to pit your setup against my MC-12, Model 770, and my Aerial 10Ts?

Jeff

P.S. One of the big problems with SACD (and DVD-A) is that they still haven't established a non-proprietary multi-channel digital connection That means that you're taking a digital signal, converting it to analog, converting it back to digital for processing, and then converting it back again to analog for amplification. Until there is a standard multi-channel connection, I think the formats are dead in the water.

I can hear the difference the conversions makes with my MC-12: imagine how must it must affect the owner of the average Sony receiver, whose DACs and ADCs will not be nearly the same quality as the Lex's.

I wish these paranoid dolts in the record industry would get off their duffs before SACD and DVD-A goes the way of Betamax.

Jeff

a smart man knows when to walk away...i bow to the MC-12.

except where sacd is concerned. no DSP needed with the 950. digital to analog in my sony ns900v, passed through the 950's analog BM and preamp stage.

a bit of placement, phase and level tweaking and my own discrete LFE sub work around, and...very, very good sound.

I think you may be misunderstanding the conversion process. SACD (or DVD-A) digital to analog processing is done in the player. The resulting analog signal is passed to the 950 via its 5.1 multi-channel analog inputs, bypassing (6-channel bypass!) any DSP processing. I understand you can do this A/D, D/A with your MC-12 to allow for some bass management, but it is not necessary. IMO, comparing Logic 7 to SACD is like comparing apples to oranges! Best wishes!

No, I understand the process all-right. Sure, you can use the 950's (or the MC-12's) analog bypass if you want, but then you lose out on all the enhancements your processor can give you, such as time-alignment and, in the MC-12's case, bass management, surround processing, and more.

Sure, I could run my 10Ts full-range through my MC-12's analog bypass, but then what's the point of a surround processor at all? Why not just hook the SACD player directly to my amplifiers?

The fact that there's a cheesy workaround doesn't absolve the recording industry from this travesty. DVD-A and SACD are digital media, and forcing a conversion to analog simply to prevent bit-perfect copies is a terrible solution that severely handicaps the quality of what you're getting.

Anyway, maybe there are some SACDs or DVD-As that sound better than a conventional CD piped through Logic-7. I've only listened to three or four DVD-As in my home, and no SACDs, so I'm not the best judge. However, those that I've listened to sounded better -- but not significantly better -- than standard CDs with Logic 7.

But those are just my impressions. Your mileage may vary.

But getting back to the original subject, whether inputs for SACD/DVD-A is a sine quae non really is opieie's decision. If it's important to him, that rules out the MC-1. If it's not, that makes the MC-1 his best bet.

Speaking of whom, Mr. O's been conspicuously silent recently. Opieie, you still reading this thread?

Jeff

Hello all, man I left for a couple of days and this thread has really got going, I had not considered DVD-A or SACD which pretty much rules out the Krell and the Lexicon so my search goes on, after a little more research I have come up with a few more options, B&K Ref 30, Rotel 1066 and the outlaw which all have 5.1 inputs, I have not heard any DVD Audio or SACD myself but I would hate to be left out if these become more popular, for what it's worth the B&K Ref 30 has a notch filter thats supposed to help match bass to your room, don't know if this is something to consider or not, and one problem I see with the Outlaw is the remote, it does not have seperate transport and menu controls for DVD players which does not effect the sound but........, anyway thank you all for your input this has already stopped me from one mistake.

Opieie,

Excellent. So we've eliminated the Lex and (thankfully!) the Krell.

Now that we're in the area of B&K, Rotel, and Outlaw, I strongly recommend considering the Outlaw. All three make extremely good equipment (although I've experienced quality control problems with B&K before), but given the nature of the retail sales markup, you're likely to get better quality for the dollar going with the Outlaw.

Unless there's a specific feature that one of the others have that the Outlaw doesn't, it's likely to be your best bet.

(Outlaws: does the 950 have DPLII?)

Jeff

Not so. I have bass management with the 950 if I choose to use it. I have time alignment available through my SACD player. I have no need for further "surround processing" with SACD.

Well, I don't know about you, but I bought my 950 to use first and foremost as a 5.1/7.1 surround processor for DD, DTS, DD-EX, DTS-ES, etc.

Why not? You have posted in this thread that, in your opinion, the MC-1 is superior to the 950 while admitting you have never listened to a 950.
You went on to say: Good advice- especially before passing judgement on a product- wouldn't you agree?
And it does, a little!
By the way, I'll bet your system sounds fabulous. I'm envious! Best wishes.

And, not having heard what good surround processing can do for your SACD, you'll probably be fine with what you've got.




And I bought my Lexicon for surround processing in all those, plus for music, too. (Well, not all those: I really couldn't care much less about the various DTS spawn.)

Besides, DD and its kin are surrounded-encoded programs much like SACD and DVD-A. Surely, you wouldn't stoop to surround processing on the DD and DTS sources, right? I mean, you just listen to them in standard DD and DTS modes, right?



Yup, that is indeed my opinion. I know this country's going to hell in handbasket and all, but as far as I know, I'm still permitted to hold my own opinion, whether you feel it's a good one or not.

If both Hyundai and Porsche came out with a new car for 2004, which do you think will probably drive faster? Or would you have no opinion whatsoever on the subject until you've driven both?



Indeed I did. Thank you for the liberal quoting.



Dear me, a barb from an officer of the Thought Police. And here I naively thought that I was entitled to have my own opinions, based on my extensive experience with home theater products in general, and a good amount with Lexicon and Outlaw in particular.

But I guess that doesn't entitle me to an opinion. Tell me, please, where do I register for an Opinion Eligibility Card? Can I do that at the post office?



Evidently.



Thank you. I'm actually a bit sad, because I can't think of much I can do to improve on it, and like opieie, I'm a bit of a tweaker. I won't waste money on snake oil like "audiophile" audio, video, and power cables, and I rent an apartment, so I can't do room treatment or paint the place neutral grey. Not sure what else to do next.

Jeff

And, not having heard what good surround processing can do for your SACD, you'll probably be fine with what you've got

UGGG I can’t do this right now but one thought. Did I speed read all this thread correctly. You’d prefer a lower resolution 2-channel CD processed via L7 VS potential 5.1 discreet channels at higher resolution. Although the quality of the HR discs and quantity placed in each channel IS all over the map currently.
(and do you prefer DD over DTS?) (or just DD vs the spawn?!) Eki! our ears are different. I do like your MC12!
Logic 7 is VERY good ….but its not that good!