I just ordered HDTV through my local cable company (Cox San Diego)! So far, they have NBC, ABC, CBS, PBS and HBO/Showtime in HDTV. I am not getting the premium channels right now, but I am pretty excited about the local stations. I will let you all know how it works out. The installation will be on the 27th.

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Benjamin King
benjaminking@yahoo.com

I'm in Cox North County, Ben. Let me know how it goes; I am about to put an antenna up on my roof for OTA. I should be able to get both SD and LA stations from here; I'm not sure what advantage cable has other than premium channels (and a monthly charge). I'd rather rent a DVD than watch the compressed HD movie, I think.
Mike

I will definitely let you all know how it goes. srfdude, I am barely able to get OTA signals in the hills, so I figured that I had little chance of HDOTA. Also with the Cox digital telephone, cable modem and HDTV, I am only paying around $100.00 a month. Considering that my phone bill used to be around $50 to $65, and AOL (shudder...) used to be about $26, I figure that going with a cable modem and HDTV would be worth $25 more per month. Does this sound like a commercial?

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Benjamin King
benjaminking@yahoo.com

"Does this sound like a commercial?"

Not really, just smart spending. Getting all three from the same company will usually save money. Many places should have some sort of package deal.

My CATV company (Comcast) just raised rates again for like the 3rd time this year... it's starting to get annoying...

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Matthew J. Hill
matt@idsi.net

FYI - Browsing through slashdot revealed this article: http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=technologyNews&storyID=1937711

To summarize the high points..
The deal would establish nationwide technical standards for cable systems, ensuring that high-definition television sets would be able to plug into nearly any cable system in the country and receive digital signals without requiring costly extra equipment.

Signing off on the deal were 14 consumer electronics manufacturers, including Japan's Sony Corp. and the Netherlands' Philips Electronics NV, as well as cable operators which have 75 percent of the U.S. market, including Comcast Corp and AOL Time Warner Inc.
So maybe there is a light in the tunnel after all.

Yeah, saw the same article at Digital Bits earlier today. There's hope...

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gonk -- Saloon Links | Pre/Pro Comparison Chart | 950 Review

I read it a few days ago, also, and one thing in particular stuck out in my mind:

"But another major question -- the extent to which consumers should be able to record shows for their personal use -- remains unresolved."

Definitely a worrisome problem. The Supreme Court has already ruled (in a case concerning BetaMax, of all things) that VCRs and their essential functions are legal. I'm seeing a definite trend on the part of the studios to attempt to erode those rights through technological means.

The basic irony of the situation is, even though it is legal to do xxx, if the studios (or anybody, for that matter) manages to use technological means to prevent you from doing xxx, even though they are not permitted to legally prohibit you from doing it, the DMCA prevents you from bypassing those technological means to perform the action you ought to be legally entitled to perform.

Gotta love America, eh?

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Matthew J. Hill
matt@idsi.net

I wonder how much influence content providers will have on these standards agreed upon. As I understand it the FCC still has to approve the compromise so I suppose we still could run into delays. When I first read this I feared this would render any HDTV purchases (Jan for me I hope) obsolete but as I read it more thoroughly that seems not to be the case.

On a side note it might just be me but reading "even though it is legal to do xxx" instead of "even though it is legal to do x" places a whole different slant on the statement.

What isn't clear in any of the press releases is whether existing monitors (i.e. anyone that plans to use their component inputs) will receive anything but upconverted material. The big problem with the previous proposals were that the content provider got to determine what resolution would be permitted outside the encrypted signal. I still don't know if I have a very expensive boat anchor in my home theater.

How do you know you've been messing with HD in your living room too much lately?
Driving to fight Christmas crowds to mall tonight.

Himself: Look at the moon, its in 1080i tonight.
Me: No its big but it looks flat, must be SD, 480i at the most.

TurnerF:


Unfortunately, they have enough influence to have gotten the DMCA passed into law, don't they?

Stuff like this worries me.


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Matthew J. Hill
matt@idsi.net

Just bought a new RPTV w/integrated tuner a couple of weeks ago. I can get the local CBS station with a small loop antenna (my HT is in the lower level of a raised ranch). I live in a COX Cable area, they claim that COX HD will "be available in 2003". No indication if that means early or late. My whole area *is* running on fiber, so ... my fingers are crossed that it'll be earlier rather than later. Plus one of the nearby Comcast areas has just started offering HD, so there's some local pressure for it.

Regardless, I'm leaning towards putting up a roof antenna this spring ... I do like the thought of free HD via OTA. Anyhow, I'm really looking forward to hearing how you like it Ben!



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pat----

email: pat@sklenar.info ---===--- home page: Grumpy's Lair

I got the install done last week, and I am in love with HDTV! Last night was the first night that I had a real choice in what to watch, though. All weekend, the local CBS HD feed was out, which left slim pickins from the other networks. The PBS HD feed is on 20 hours a day, and has some interesting programming.

The cable feed is not perfect, though. If I set the box to output Dolby Digital, the levels are all off, and the signal cuts in and out at a ridiculous rate. Also, the sound level went from low to really low, and back in unexpected paterns. Being obviously unacceptable, and I thought about cancelling the service. Once I switched it back to the stereo output though, all was well. To be honest, DPL2 C does great justice to the clean stereo signal, and I don't think I'm missing much, since the soundtracks for the TV shows haven't been that exciting (compared to action packed DVD's like the Bond collection I got for Christmas). I can't wait to watch some sports!! I read that ABC is broadcasting teh Super Bowl, Stanley Cup, and my personal favorite, the NBA Finals in HD!

After watching a few shows last night, I have to say that on the networks, "CSI: Miami" was the most impressive display of HD. But PBS has that beat with just about every show they have. There is a show called "Trains Ahead" or something like that, and looks amazing!

Movies have been less impressive. I saw Mrs. Doubtfire, and The Sound of Music. Both looked amazing compared to the standard version, but only on occasion really looked better than DVD. The Sound of Music was obviously not the best choice for showing off HD capabilities because of its age and its soft texture, but even when watching Mrs. Doubtfire, there were only a few times when I saw a huge improvement. Maybe if I saw the DVD side by side I would see more contrast. After watching Mrs. Doubtfire, I put in a few DVDs, and was amazed at how close the two are. I honestly don't know if the average person would care too much about the jump in quality to HD. If HD DVD ever comes about, and the price is much higher than current DVD players and discs, I can't see it taking off anytime soon.

In summary, I am happy to spend the extra $7.00 per month to get the HDTV channels. There is a good amount of programming available, especially at the time that I am watching.


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Benjamin King
benjaminking@yahoo.com

I did notice with HD that at least here it sometimes doesn't make sense what is in HD and what is not! Here the Sun bowl is in HD today but the Rose,Sugar and Orange are not?! That and in Mpls our PBS chose to use their bandwidth for multicasting instead of HD.
So I guess you get what you get when you are a early adopter.


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m-mmeyer
GO TWINS
My DVD's

Benjamin,

Did you have to have the decoder/modem for cable upgraded to a HD capable box?
And if so did you notice a difference in the quality of your Standard Definition cable feed when you added it?

I’ve noticed a weird situation when shopping prices for two HD satellite STB’s. While contacting Radio Shack, Dish, and Direct TV, I was asked by employees of each why I ‘cared’ about HD since not many channels are on line yet.

I thought that was a little strange as you think all the above would be pushing it. Even my satellite dish upgrade installer seemed to be grumpy remarking that he and other installers like him were in a ‘learn as you go situation’ as regards HD. This after he had trouble locking signal in on the new HD triple LNB dish. He wanted to bypass my panamax to ‘fix’ the problem. I told him that could be a issue for me as I was not willing to bypass the protective circuits of the panamax unless an alternative method of protection could be used on the coax line-in which would could pass through (his words…the more ‘sensitive’ HD feed). The install glitch turned out, - after much elimination - that he had tuned the main LNB to the wrong satellite.

What I have found being an early adopter of HD off satellite, is the benefit of the higher end HD capable receiver/decoders (STB).
I can only assume the Bandwidth capabilities, the resistors, the filters, general build is of much higher quality than a standard satellite box.
The HD box cleans up all my SD satellite on my 60 “ screen (and it needs it) to an extremely visible degree. At its best (less compressed signal) comparable to the difference a high-bit progressive scan DVD player makes on a large screen.
For the cleanup of my SD alone an HD box is worth the price of admission, regardless of HD hours-per-day scarcity.

SLL,

Yes, I did have to get a new decoder box in order to get HD. As far as an improvement in SD channels, I don't think so. I didn't have any issues before, though.

After reading my last post, I thought that I sounded a bit critical. I wanted to make this clear...

I know that HD CAN look great, and it does. It's just that certain programs show it off much more than others do. When I upgraded from an interlaced to progressive DVD player, I noticed a huge jump in picture quality. When I compare that picture with HD, I would say that the difference is about the same. In other words, I would say that the improvement in going from interlaced to progressive DVD is about the same as the improvement from going from progressive DVD to HD.

DISCLAIMER: When I say "HD", I mean regular, sitcom type programming and the two movies that I was able to see so far. Good or great HD programming, on the other hand, is a very noticable and stunning difference.



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Benjamin King
benjaminking@yahoo.com

SLL,
What HD decoder did you get? The Direct TV guy is coming Friday to install my dish and then I will be shopping for a HD decoder. I am confused by all the different choices - and can't find anyone who has them running in store so I can see the difference.

As far as an improvement in SD channels, I don't think so. I didn't have any issues before, though.
Could be just my particular display is needy of it. Or (I can’t remember what screen size your running) I noticed a consensus that some who jump to a progressive DVD player on a smaller high-quality CRT screen do not notice a huge improvement. (or not large enough for the dollars). It seems to be the large signal hungry screens that realize a net noticeable improvement. (Trash blown up is BAD).

I see the same as you between programming (HD feed signal quality). Some HD I’ve run into has been riveting, some no better than a high quality DVD recording played through a progressive player.
When you get that ‘blend’ best quality HD feed on your HD capable/integrated screen it can pop out at you. Looking forward to slowly seeing more and more of it. The other day I ran into a football game on 13.2 (?) here. It was so beautiful and lifelike so, down (on and in) the field I had to watch it for awhile, even though the game did not interest me.

Turner F. First we purchased a HD RCA-DTC100. I believe just (or about) to be discontinued so it might be found for a good price. Once we had the 60” inch enlarged trash problem on our hands - It dramatically improved SD for us over the original Direct TV provided box, before we even switched out the single round dish for the dual HD dish. However the DTC100 was SLOW to aquire channel change lock and menu descriptions) We then switched to the Sony HD200, again just before the dish itself was switched out a couple of weeks ago. Again PQ improved on SD material. (Slightly) Channel switch and movie details screen load amazing faster than the DTC100. Still, the HD200 has my eyebrow raised for 30 days. On the AVS boards, the HD200 has had some digital audio dropouts to a point of being unusable for some since its launch. Some of this behavior was traced to the bit-stream signal from certain stations, and having e-mails flying to station managers around the county, when the signals were changed the problems were reduced. Some seem connected to a sensitive and faulty (resistor) I believe. (that issue was supposedly addressed). Still something in the Sony seems sensitive to audio signal loss in a way that older HD models did not exhibit such as Hughs. The other issue with the HD200 has been reboots. (which wipes your favorites channels) and interrupts viewing as the 200 takes about 1 to 2 min. to rescan all channels on a reboot.

We’ve had the reboot twice but no digital audio dropouts. It might be interesting to note that some conjectured on the AVS boards that certain prepro/receiver brands and models (Sony, Denon, B&K Ref50) might have conflict with the HD200 creating some of the digital dropouts. Paired with my 950/770 we have had NO audio dropouts. Because of the signal hungry nature of my display which really requires the HD boxes quality to make SD watchable and the fact it has DVI, which the HD200 also sports (and my husband wants the use of that connection). We may keep the Sony, but the jury’s still out here.
Yes it’s a better PQ than the older model DTC100. But the unit has some issues.
If your doing a search on boxes on shelves be aware that the Zenith HD520 is the same platform as the Sony HD200 (both made by LG electronics). You won’t trade off any issues (just how you feel about choosing which CS you get stuck with and 100 bill less for the Zenith) by choosing between those 2 models.
Go to AVS forum to the HDTV hardware section, here:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?s=38b5750e524f6df1015a2745d9847433&forumid=25
you will find many user reviews on the current models and a nice stuck header by AVS listing new models with what specs are confirmed with estimated releases in the next year.

Also keep the Samsung SIR ts-160 in mind. I have had mine for a couple of weeks and am loving it. It is equivalent model to the Sony HD-200. I like my Samsung because all I had to do was plug in the sat line the cable line and the OTA line and tell the box what I plugged in and where I am and it went and found everything for me! That and it is about time that they got it so all you have to have is 1 box. "One box to rule them all!!!"




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m-mmeyer
GO TWINS
My DVD's

Zenith HD520 is the same platform as the Sony HD200

I Revoke any recomendation as regards a demo of these two new models of HD STB's. (supporting hardware for Direct Subscribers)

My recomendation is NO BUY at the current time if anyone is researching. If details are desired by a shopper let me know.
Drat! and Damnation!... have to take it back TODAY on my (30th day) window, interferring with a very heavy work load.

I saw the Tenn./Pits. game in HD yesterday... Oh, my... I would switch back and forth between the analogue and digital channels, and be amazed every time that I ever thought "old" TV was even watchable! To use the old saying, "It was like being there!" Only, now, I mean it. I could see the blades of grass on the field... I could see dimension across the linemen. When I switched back to analogue, the picture was blurry and flat, and difficult to make out exactly what was happening. Wow! I can’t wait for the game today, and I really can’t wait until the NBA finals!


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Benjamin King
benjaminking@yahoo.com