ICBM again?

Nice pics of the new ICBM-2, Outlaw. This looks like a very interesting re-birth for a much-loved component.

I notice they included height channels which is absent on the spy photos of the 978. Can I assume this will be included in the 988?

The 978 will be a 7.1 device. As with the Marantz AV7005 the two back channels can be switched to height channels instead. Your choice.

The ICBM will include 9.2 channels so that it is ready for any set-up.

I think you mean the 998, which is a preamp/processor and therefor a different animal. I would not assume anything at this point however. Depending on the design of 998 (or the 978 for that matter), it will be interesting to see if the ICBM 2 is really needed with either prepro. I see that there is a stereo sub switch on the ICBM 2, variable crossovers on all channels down to 30 HZ, and balanced connections in and out. I don't know of anything like it out there right now.

The reason for the ICBM-2 is to support legacy hardware - at least mainly. While I am sure we can come up with scenarios in which the ICBM-2 can be used with new surround processors, the main target is folks with multichannel analog sources that have limited (or no) bass management. With the volume control, it could even be a two-input multichannel analog pre-amp...

Well this looks to be a sweet piece of bass management equipment.
I currently use the classic version of the ICBM currently connected to an OPPO BDP-93 and it works superbly.
With the XLR inputs, it would be an even better match to a BDP-95 which has the XLR outputs.
Oh wait, I just checked the savings account and see only dust and cobwebs in an empty vault.

On the surface, when I first looked at this unit, my initial impression was that with forthcoming players like the Oppo BDP95 and perhaps other audiophile units with their "juiced-up" analog circuitry, it would seem, to me anyway, this would appeal to those that preferred analog connections, with or without HDMI availability in their AVR/Pre-Pros. Prior to having an HDMI capable Pre-Pro, I had an ICBM-1 used primarily for SACD and DVD Audio bass management out of a legacy DVD player that I owned and it worked beautifully. If there was one minor drawback to the ICBM-1 and its operation is that it did add some noticeable noise to the signal path. I would hope this new model is quieter.

I think it is great Outlaw has updated the ICBM with the ICBM-2. I have an ICBM in the wings ready for use in a 2-channel system using monitors and a subwoofer. My setup will only use a fraction of the ICBM's inputs but it was really the best high/low pass filter out there. I particularly like the ability to select a 12 or 36db/octave filter curve on the subwoofer crossover. The ICBM-2 adds greater connectivity and while the crossover frequencies are closer together yielding better fine tuning they stop at 80 while the ICBM's crossovers are further apart and include 100 and 120 Hz. 2-channel systems are certainly not the market for the ICBM-2 but limiting the crossover frequencies to a maximum of 80Hz might reduce the market for folks wanting to add bass management to their 2-channel systems plus those with HT speakers that should be crossed over above 80Hz.

Deftly sidestepping the question at hand, nice. 'No comment' on the 998's channels.

I'm so happy to read that ! I have an ICBM-1, and i have a ButtKicker (who need to be filtered for ULF), and i use a Harman-Kardon Signature 1.0 pre-amplifier only to set the master volume. My only source is a Sony 5000ES. With that ICBM-2, i will do all that i want in only one (master) piece !

SYLEX (a frenchy)

Some suggestions :
- Filters from 30 to 100 (120 like on V1 ?) Hz
- Adjustable Slope
- LFE Level Button that can stop easily and precisely at 0 dB
- Sub Level from -Infinite to 0 (not from o to O)

Some questions :
- Is there a remote (No i suppose) ?
- Why is there LFE Input and EXT-Sub L/R Input ?
- Is there an external alimentation ? Or if it is an internal one, could it be used in 110 and 220 Volts ?

Thank's for all !

I think the answer is "no" - there's no IR sensor window on the front panel.


The Ext. Sub inputs were not included on the original ICBM, so we can't rely on that manual to predict what they are intending there. It seems likely that they are trying to support source equipment that offers discrete left and right subwoofer signals. If that's the case, I suspect the Ext. Sub inputs will be rarely used - most users will go to the LFE input.


The power supply is internal (the power cord connection is an IEC style, which means it's designed for a cord to go straight to the wall). It's hard to make out the silk screened text above the power connection, but it may say "100V-240V". If it does, that suggests the power supply might be compatible with both US (120V 60Hz) and European (220V 50Hz) power. We'll have to wait for more information to emerge to be certain, though.

Thank's.

I've made the same suppositions. But i rather have an "official" response. Wait and see.

Good plan. The manual will confirm it for us when it's ready.

Let's say you have an AV processor with internal bass management for digital sources, but for analog multichannel it uses a "bypass" input.

Or let's say you have an AVR with no means to drive the amplifier inputs directly, so no means to patch the ICBM2 between the pre-outs and amp inputs.

In either case, the ICBM2 would be situated up front, feeding the Mch analog input. That input is most likely limited to one subwoofer channel. That would prevent its volume control from controlling the main and ULF outputs created by the ICBM2.

To solve that, the Ext Sub input allows the processor's subwoofer output to feed the sub crossover inside the ICBM2. This makes the Main/ULF sub crossover feature available for both the analog bypass path as well as processor's internal subwoofer signal created by digital bass management.

Make sense?

First off: how did I miss this initial announcement?

Secondly: woo hoo! It's NOT Made in China. This moves it to my "never in your life" to "buy" list!

Thirdly: love that it's 9.1 - since the ICBM-1 was lacking in channels - at least for my needs today. And

Finally: I somewhat disagree with Gonk's first post about its applicability. In my case it has nothing to do with legacy systems but rather with dealing with a multiple sub set-up that cannot be bass-managed the way I want using my Onkyo 886's capabilities alone. I want three of my powered subs to handle the "bass managed" signals from the "7" channels (which is also routed through an SMS-1), while a separate sub is dedicated to LFE alone. I can do it (almost) with the ICBM-1, however because it's only a 6.1 system, I currently have to use the Onkyo for the two Rear Surr channels. The ICBM-2 cures that inadequacy.

So Peter tell me please: when can you ship me one to a US address?

Jeff Mackwood

ps. Did I mention how happy I am that it's NOT Made in China!

Well Jeff,

We moved production to Taiwan because we knew we would be short one customer if we built it in China. This internally was known as the "Mackwood" solution.

By the way it is not 9.1 but 9.2. We actually construct "stereo" bass using additive signals from 50% combined center channel and then right channel, right surround channel and right back surround channel. The same goes for the left channels.This feature is carried over from the original ICBM and was initially suggested by engineers at Dolby, who consulted in that first design.

This is a very good point. The most immediately obvious application is probably for legacy systems, but the flexibility inherent in the array of inputs (two separate multichannel) and options for bass management as well as volume control do open the door for a lot of pretty fun scenarios beyond "just" legacy hardware.

Peter,

You just know that I relish any opportunity to set Corporate America back on the right track!

You also know that I'm good to my word; that I will support companies who's products are NOT Made in China. Put me down for a unit, price unseen. Seriously.

And thanks for the clarification about the unit's functionality. While not something that I currently need, it seems like a great feature that others might want.

Jeff

+1

Isn't it 9.4 ? With 2 "standards" Subs and 2 "ULFs" (Buttkickers or Actuators or ...). Stéréo for both Subs and ULFs, and separated filters...

Under 80 Hz, the bass can't be localizable. So under 80 Hz, stereo is not really necessary for Subs ! But some good small speakers don't go under 100 or 120 Hz, and in that case, a pair of Subs and an ICBM-1 was THE solution. V2 not !

Conversely, 10 Hz steps isn't absolutely necessary. I think that the 40,60,80,100 and 120 Hz who where on the ICBM-1 was perfect. And people who want to filter at 30 or 50 Hz could use ULF Out.

That would cause problems unless the high-pass out from the ULF crossover is used.

Some news ?

An other suggestion : ULF (Out) Level different from SUB (Out) Level (and different from LFE (In) Level, and from Master Volume) ?

One more suggestion : a switch to choice between LFE or LFE + BM to go on ULF Out. For Buttkickers or Actuators, it's better to have only LFE signal (whith LPF).